Until We Get Canceled
42 episodes - English - Latest episode: over 2 years ago - ★★★★★ - 19 ratingsThis is a talk show by progressive Christians for… well, we don’t care who listens. We want to bring up conversations that we know are happening in a lot of Christian communities and bring them to the forefront, with some levity and our tongues planted firmly in cheek. We know there are a lot of people of faith who support equal rights for everyone, who know that love is love, who believe that #BlackLivesMatter, who want to engage with faith in a different way than their parents did, and who want to replace the Christian patriarchy with a new cult of the sacred feminine led by Ian McKellen — and we want to give those communities a platform.
We’re here. We’re tolerant. Get used to it… until we get canceled.
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Episodes
42. Getting Owned in My Heart
August 30, 2021 11:00 - 45 minutes - 51.6 MBWell, it’s happened, folks. We’ve been cancelled – by ourselves. No, not really, but we do have two big announcements to make. First, CJ will be stepping down from co-host to occasional guest host (and he will be sorely missed). And second, after next week, we will be taking a hiatus as Isaac adjusts to dad life and ponders whether he likes Brian enough to keep podcasting. We’ll be back with new formats and new ideas or we’ll drift off into the ether. In the meantime, we reminisce over what ...
41. The Atrocities of Gay Conversion Therapy
August 15, 2021 11:00 - 47 minutes - 54.6 MBContent Warning: We discuss gay conversion therapy and Netflix’s documentary Pray Away in this episode. The documentary, Pray Away, follows four members of Exodus International, a global conversion therapy advocate. This was going on behind our backs all along. So few were aware of how prevalent it really was. So much of the anti-gay movement was tied up in fears around the AIDS epidemic, and the church drove a big part of that. We discuss some of the history surrounding the documentary, ho...
40. Emotionally Manipulating People Into Orgasm During the Praise Chorus
August 08, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 83.4 MBThis could be the one that gets us canceled. Who’d have thought it would come to the point of defending a Will Willimon article? The article is presented as a conversation between Stanley Hauerwas and Will Willimon on the dangers of providing pastoral care and, honestly, they bring up some good points. 99% of seminarians expect to go out challenging people’s theological beliefs and pushing boundaries, but when they get there they find that it’s not what people want. On top of that, pastors a...
39. Hot Gossip from the Evangelical World
August 01, 2021 11:00 - 51 minutes - 58.7 MBWe’re coming to you with some hot evangelical gossip! Former Chicago Cub and 2016 World Series MVP Ben Zobrist and Faith Hill’s stunt double Julianna Zobrist have canceled their marriage. As the divorce filings became public, details are starting to come out and they’re saucy stuff. The intersection of sports, pastors, and grinding on the dancefloor was too juicy to pass up. We break down the dish, rank this in the pantheon of evangelical scandals, and dive into the NBA finals. Resources: ...
38. There’s Nothing More Redneck Than Saying ACAB
July 25, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 73 MBRyan Cagel is a habitual church worker, Christian – sometimes against his better interests – and game designer. He’s planting a faith community structured around mutual aid and solidarity in the backwoods of Alabama, known as Jubilee House. It’s focused on anti-racist, LGBTQ+ inclusion, and anti-capitalist work. Everyone has their preconceptions of what The South is like, but Alabama has a long history of radical thought and the people there tend to help those in need. No one is coming to sa...
37. Unpacking “Helicopter Story” & Queer Theory
July 18, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 70.4 MBBad faith arguments on Twitter do actual harm. We talk about a recent Vox article detailing the fallout surrounding Isabel Fall over a short story titled “I Sexually Identify as an Attack Helicopter.” The story takes a common transphobic meme and turns it on its head by applying it literally to a science fiction world. Isabel, a trans woman, received threats and backlash over the story she published in January 2020, causing her to not only check into a hospital but make the decision to halt ...
36. The Holy Spirit Saying “F#%* Around & Find Out”
July 11, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 75.2 MBFriend of coal miners, Nathan Thomas, joins us for some lukewarm Appalachia takes. He’s involved in a mutual aid organization in West Virginia, and we talk about how that’s structured, what they do, and what it takes to keep it running. As Nathan puts it, “There’s no tech bros coming to save Appalachia, so we are the only help we have.” Capitalism has a way of telling us that taking care of others comes at the risk of ending up with nothing ourselves, but that’s a trap we can’t stand for. Na...
35. I Blame The West Wing for This
July 04, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 78 MBEver since we talked about “The Falcon and the Winter Soldier” a few months back, people have been howling in anticipation of our thoughts on the finale. We give our latest takes on the MCU’s role in the military industrial complex, how they present leftist movements in the meda (and what that likely says about how all media will present them in the future), and the entertainment that is keeping us alive, this late into the pandemic. Until We Get Canceled is a Crate Original from Crate Media
34. You Do Not “Got to Hand It” to the SBC
June 27, 2021 11:00 - 56 minutes - 64.1 MBSomething big has happened in the Southern Baptist Convention. We’re not Southern Baptist, but who could resist weighing in on church drama? It’s our jam. And let’s be real: any church with “South” in the name has got some seriously racist roots. We dive headfirst into the drama, from their stance on Critical Race Theory, their attempts to silence sexual abuse victims within the church, and how, surprisingly, the Southern Baptist managed to do more regarding sexual abuse than the Catholic Ch...
33. Friday Night Lights Goes to Church
June 20, 2021 11:00 - 59 minutes - 68 MBKelsey McKinney is an author and co-founder of Defector.com. She was a staff writer at Deadspin, a vertical of Gawker Media that was founded on the principle of saying what they mean and holding nothing back. It was eventually mauled through various mergers and acquisitions, when the new people in charge tried to shift those editorial values. In an inspiring show of comradery, the staff writers unanimously decided to walk out. Her new novel, “God Spare the Girls,” explores the daughters of a...
32. The Bible is Gay Fanfic
June 13, 2021 11:00 - 54 minutes - 62 MBWhenever we reference our one listener, know that we’re talking about Luke Melonakos-Harrison. Making the transition from fan to guest, he joins us to talk about the Bible, the role it’s played in his life, and his spirituality. Growing up, the church tells us what God is or isn’t. The beauty of the Bible is in the opportunity to develop your own understanding of God, Jesus, and faith without being told what to think. He also talks about what it was like reimagining his relationship with scr...
31. How to Make Enemies & Alienate People
June 06, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 88.1 MBReturning guest, Melissa Florer-Bixler, is the pastor of Raleigh Mennonite Church and author of many books – most recently: “How to Have an Enemy: Righteous Anger & the Work of Peace.” The book tackles just about everything that the white Church needs to start having hard conversations about. The question that emerged for Melissa after the 2016 election – as it did for many of us, I’m sure – was, “How the hell did we end up with a white supremacist as the president of our country?” When whi...
30. Evangelism at the Barnes & Noble
May 23, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 74.7 MBA few weeks back, we had a conversation about youth ministry where we ostensibly shat all over it. Feeling that we left a lot on the table, Blair Wilner wanted to take us to task for the things we said. Blair, a University of Virginia PhD student of religious studies, is currently celebrating the 11th anniversary of his liberation from the world of youth ministry, and finds himself in the ironic position of defending it. But even with his defensive stance, it’s not all sunshine and rainbows....
29. Josh Christ, Superstar
May 18, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 91.6 MBThis one’s basically just a big, extended fight corner. Isaac dives headlong into how the movie Get Out perfectly explains his personal beef with Hamilton — the play, not the person — and how it’s not all that different from the woke white supremacy of an intersectional CIA recruitment ad. But this week’s headline fight involves The Liturgists Podcast. Let’s get this out of the way first, this podcast probably wouldn’t exist if The Liturgists didn’t suck so much. The gang talks about how tha...
28. Super Gay & Happy to be Here
May 09, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 96.2 MBSemler, aka Grace Baldridge, is a documentary host and singer/songwriter. She recently put out a record “Preacher’s Kid” which hit the #1 spot on Christian iTunes, and she’s taking Contemporary Christian Music to task. She feels strongly about standing up for what she believes in because the rest of the CCM world tries to skirt around issues of accountability. Christians are not beyond reproach. How can you claim to stand up for what you believe in while being propped up by a platform that b...
27. Unlicensed Social Workers Unite!
May 02, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 76.5 MBReturn guest Sara Zarr already gave us her full bio the last time she was on the show, so here’s a few more facts beyond being an author and killer podcast host: She’s a friend of Bryan, an adult child of alcoholics, and a semi-ex evangelical. She understands the issues with codependent thinking, which gives her an excellent perspective on how the church actually encourages codependency with its followers. We talk about what codependency actually is, how to develop healthy boundaries with Go...
26. Being a Good White Christian on the Internet
April 25, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 99.9 MBD.L. Mayfield is a writer who just really, really wants to be a good neighbor. In her latest book, "The Myth of the American Dream," she explores whether or not the individualistic and autonomous values of the American Dream are at all compatible with Jesus’ instruction to “love thy neighbor as thyself.” Her goal as a writer has been to connect people while simultaneously unsettling them. In this conversation we discuss the love-hate relationship of social media, whether it is used to create...
25. Being a Queer Chaplain is Weird
April 18, 2021 11:00 - 55 minutes - 63.7 MBCaitlin Stout is a student at Vanderbilt Divinity School — at least for the next few weeks. She will soon be graduating with her Masters in Divinity with a concentration in Chaplaincy. She’s been on the nigh endless journey of figuring out what ministry looks like as a queer person in Tennessee. We often place the burden of assimilation on the victim of queer phobia instead of holding the religious institutions and individuals responsible for progress. We talk about using religious belief as...
24. Loneliness & Connection Through the Pandemic
April 11, 2021 11:00 - 59 minutes - 68.2 MBCharlotte Donlon is a writer, certified spiritual director, and a Christian woman in the deep south who has opinions. Those opinions caused some conflict when the way some churches handled events such as the murder of George Floyd isolated her from her church community. We discuss her book "The Great Belonging," the upside of loneliness, what a spiritual director does, and connecting with yourself through art and faith. Resources: charlottedonlon.com Instagram: @bookshop_org Read: "The G...
23. The First Attempt at Cancelation
April 04, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 69 MBWe kick this week off in the most Youth Minister way possible: talking about the theological implications of Marvel movies. These movies have always been some not-so-subtle propaganda for the military industrial complex, but The Falcon & The Winter Soldier takes it to the next level. But we’re not here to talk about superheroes — we’re talking about teens. Specifically: is youth group good or bad? We discuss how many of our convictions were formed in youth ministry, why things that happened ...
22. The Audacity of White Folks
March 28, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 84.9 MBIndhira Udofia is doing the damn thing. Either that, or she’s a glutton for punishment. She came to divinity school on the false premise that she would be somebody’s pastor, but she always had some tension around the church — The models never quite clicked with her. While going through seminary school, she realized that this was the source of everything she’d been wrestling with regarding the messages being preached about gender, sexuality, and race. It was a site of harmful indoctrination. ...
21. Gay Angels & Christian Witches
March 21, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 89 MBRamona Martinez is an artist who seeks to reclaim Christianity for misfits, radicals, anarchists, feminists, and outcasts of all types. Growing up, Ramona attended an Anglican church. But when she was around nine years old, that church became a central player in the Episcopal schism. This kicked off an exploration of her spirituality that led to blending magic and Christianity in some really interesting ways. We talk about how magic and Christianity have been historically interwoven, how a...
20. Slightly Whacky Atonement Theology
March 14, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 73 MBHannah Bowman joined us in episode 18 to talk about abolition theology. However, we barely scratched the topic’s surface, and the United States still has over 2,000,000 prisoners — one of the few areas where we are actually #1 — so we invited her back. Today, Hannah helps us dig deeper into abolition theology, the relationship between her faith and her abolition activism, the conversations that churches don’t want to have (but restorative justice communities do), and her ‘slightly whacky’ at...
19. Finally! The Globalist Methodist Church: A Church for Globalists!
March 07, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 84.9 MBThis week’s guest comes correct, wielding decades of progressive activism, a soundboard, and Some Thoughts on the proposed “Global Methodist Church.” Rev. Steven Martin has done quite a bit over the years, but he’s currently the Founder of The Lakelands Institute, providing education for clergy and churches so that they can navigate a new era. We talk about the church’s role in both historical and contemporary right-wing movements, the big transition that the church is in right now, the comi...
18. What Counts as Harm?
February 28, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 78.2 MBToday we’re talking about the intersection of theology and social justice with Hannah Bowman, the founder and Director of Christians for the Abolition of Prisons. She’s best known on the Twitterverse as a literary agent, but Bryan already has representation, so we're most interested in her hot abolition takes. And, on that accountability tip, we’re summoning the unholy trinity of Texas assholes to the Chili’s parking lot: Ted Cruz, Rick Perry, and Greg Abbott. Resources: Christians for the...
17. Thrumming Like a Taut Wire
February 21, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 75.2 MBWhen Isaac was at Duke Divinity School, he had a professor send an email about why diversity training is bad that said the job of a theologian is not to be concerned with the problems of the world but to be thrumming like a taut wire in their office. What does this have to do with today’s episode? Because, as always, we’re absolutely thrumming to talk about masculinity — today, in the context of “the violent liturgy of Alabama Football,” as it was described in a questionable take (one of man...
16. Jesus Doesn’t Want You to Have a Panic Attack Every Sunday
February 14, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 93.3 MBAntonia Terrazas is the creator of Holy Blacked Out, Extremely Online, and a friend of Isaac’s from seminary. She came to join us for one of their first sober conversations, but you know what? It’s still fun! We chat about growing up Evangelical, Charismatic, Fundamentalist, and homeschooled; going to David Crowder’s church, not for gay reasons; old white man fragility; the accountability(?) of ‘cancel culture;’ reminiscing about seminary, the performative aspects and the surprising ways it ...
15. How Were You Radicalized?
February 07, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 69.5 MBIsaac doesn’t have a rad soundboard, but he does have a radical agenda — and he wants you to have one, too! Today, we’re digging into what it means to be radicalized, how we were all radicalized, the pushback you receive (from some communities more than others) when you’re public about it, and how we can effectively radicalize others. Plus, fight corner is back, baby! Resources: Listen to Magdalene’s other podcast: The People’s Commentary The Communist Manifesto (free) "Caring for Souls ...
14. Rewarded for Being Performative
January 31, 2021 11:00 - 59 minutes - 54.9 MBWe’re joined by Rosie Snow, Isaac’s comrade in his meme-fueled mission to create an army of radical socialist Christians and the Director of Christian Discipleship at Wesley Memorial. We discuss attention, whether attention exists, the difference between attention and working memory, “Supernatural” Tumblrs, our relationship (or lack thereof) to the non-human world, and how social media is affecting all of that. Resources: "How to Do Nothing: Resisting the Attention Economy" by Jenny Odell ...
13. Totally Gay Stuff That’s Not With or For Straights
January 24, 2021 11:00 - 54 minutes - 50.2 MBThe gang’s all here! And we’re joined by L Finke, who is doing incredible work to advocate for the LGBTQ+ Christian community and provide support for how parents and the greater Christian community can best support their LGBTQ+ friends and family. She’s been busy over the last couple years, writing two books — “Queerfully and Wonderfully Made: A Guide for LGBTQ+ Christian Teens” and “Welcoming and Affirming: A Guide to Supporting and Working with LGBTQ+ Christian Youth” — and producing two d...
12. Shocked by Shock: Looking Back at January 6th & Forward to the Inauguration
January 17, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 60.7 MBWe’re joined by special guest Donna, who you can also hear dropping her insight on the Book of Ruth on The People’s Commentary, to talk about the domestic terror attack at the Capitol, white supremacy, and the upcoming inauguration. It’s time to start having some difficult conversations, and it’s time for white people to start earnestly interrogating their own whiteness. Resources: Listen to our other pod: The People’s Commentary Until We Get Canceled is a Crate Original from Crate Media
11. Big Texas Energy: The “Friday Night Lights” Episode
January 10, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 67.4 MBIsaac’s back, and Bryan pissed him off before the episode even started! We’re also joined by Ellie Singer, an Extremely Online Gen-Z Episcopalian who currently lives in Houston. We’re all big fans of that one time Ellie tweeted about Friday Night Lights and the Bible, so we brought her on to expound on her Midrash of the “Friday Night Lights” canon, and we reflect on how it fits so serendipitously in all of our lives, generations apart. That’s right, it’s the “Friday Night Lights” episode th...
10. The People Who Got into Jesus Instead of Drugs
January 03, 2021 11:00 - 1 hour - 56.1 MBSara Zarr is a prolific author, a national book awards finalist (which Bryan isn’t bitter about *at all*), and the host of This Creative Life. We talk about why the range for Gen-X is whack, growing up as part of the Jesus movement in the 70s in California, getting exposed to modern evangelicalism, the tendency for cults of personality to manifest in churches, the deep sense of loss when you leave a community (even for good reasons), the phenomenon of feeling like the Holy Spirit is communic...
9. The Fall of the Prison: As the Kids Say Today, This is Fire
December 20, 2020 11:00 - 1 hour - 62.4 MBContent warning: suicidal ideation and death. Isaac’s out for surgery this week (don’t worry, he’s fine), but we brought in a great friend to sub for him: Chris Hoke, a gang pastor, jail chaplain, and the founder of Underground Ministries. He’s also an incredibly engaging writer, and Bryan gives a glowing endorsement for his book “Wanted.” We talk about how Chris learned about the bible and his community in some rough Oakland neighborhoods; going to jail to learn how to read the bible in co...
8. Obama Gave Us A Great Couple of Weeks for Ethereal Bisexuals
December 13, 2020 11:00 - 57 minutes - 52.7 MBHillary Zedlitz is a Ph.D. student at the University of Michigan who studies political science and religion and politics. Hillary is also a member of the Graduate Employees’ Organization, a grad student union, who went on strike during the pandemic to protest the university reopening plans and policing policies. On a micro level, we get into why the strike happened and how the university handled things (poorly) after the fact. And on a macro level, we explore how labor is exploited in acad...
7. Virtues for the Apocalypse
December 06, 2020 11:00 - 1 hour - 58.5 MBThis week we’re joined by Amy Peterson, an author, seminary student, quilter, master playlist maker, and seasoned podcast guest. Amy released a book in January 2020 titled “Where Goodness Still Grows: Reclaiming Virtue in an Age of Hypocrisy,” a book that was originally sold with the title “Virtues for the Apocalypse.” So, it ended up being an extra-appropriate book for 2020. As Amy puts it, unfortunately, “its relevance seems to continue.” So, we dive deep into how the 2016 election inspir...
6. God is Not a Cop & Jesus isn’t Santa Claus | 1st Week of Advent
November 29, 2020 11:00 - 1 hour - 61.1 MBWe open the show with a beautiful rendition of the story of Baylor Sword Poet, Isaac’s Twitter handle. Plus, Carrie goes in on Lord of the Rings fans (our most contentious take yet?) and we learn why Winter is a basic-ass metaphor to spell out in your poem, and all before we start the show! Then, instead of pointing and laughing at people on Twitter for the whole pod, we share some genuinely positive and constructive thoughts about deconstructing theology and faith in marginalized communitie...
5. When You Saw Only One Set of Tire Tracks, It Was When John Cena Carried You
November 22, 2020 11:00 - 1 hour - 85.8 MBBrandin Gibson joins the show to help us put the USA on blast and — more importantly — give us the comedic highlights of 2020. We talk about dealing with self-isolation as an introvert vs. extrovert, the loooooooong election week, some hot Thanksgiving food tips, turkey families vs. side dish families, binge-worthy TV to stay at home to, how Fast & Furious is calling us to obliterate the nuclear family, the MAGAification of Top Gun, the NBA bubble, and, as promised, a few moments from 2020 t...
4. Radical Lesbians for President 2024
November 15, 2020 11:00 - 1 hour - 61.2 MBAlthea Laughon-Worrell is a college student engaged in racial justice work in Charlottesville, Virginia — a town that has become more or less synonymous with white nationalist violence after August 12, 2017. On that day, protesters gathered against the removal of a statue commemorating Confederate leader Robert E. Lee. They were met with counter protesters, many students like Althea, and violence ensued. You might have also seen pictures of a mob of young white men wielding tiki torches and ...
3. Casting Crowns, Casting Ballots
November 08, 2020 11:00 - 1 hour - 68.8 MBKevin Rose joins us for an exploration of the history of public christianity in the 20th Century. We talk about what “public christianity” is, Anglican Twitter, the intersection of christianity and COVID, the relationship between big business and public christianity, whether Billy Graham would have been friends with Trump (spoiler: yes), poverty voyeurism, and the one thing that progressive christians, depressed evangelicals, and the LGBTQ+ community have in common. Plus, Carrie is back! An...
2. You Can’t Even Have A Thanksgiving Dinner With Your Racist Uncle These Days (or: Fixing the Hurt at the Soul of This Nation as We Hurdle Towards the 2020 Election)
November 01, 2020 11:00 - 1 hour - 67.8 MBMelissa Florer-Bixler is the pastor of Raleigh Mennonite Church and an author. Her book “Fire by Night” is one of the best books on the Old Testament that we’ve read in a long, long time, and she writes as a feminist working to dismantle whiteness — so that’s pretty dope. She’s currently working on a new project for a second book about enemies and how to have them, and man are we excited to see how that comes together. There’s even a chapter about your racist uncle! Speaking of which… we re...
1. The Da Vinci Code Fan Fiction Podcast
October 25, 2020 11:00 - 51 minutes - 46.9 MBIn this inaugural episode of Until We Get Canceled — which happens to also be the inaugural show of The Magdalene podcast network — your hosts Isaac Collins and Bryan Bliss share how Mary Magdalene inspired this project, and our first guest Carrie Surbaugh dunks on how wrong we are (and the UMC). Along the way, we connect the dots around a grand conspiracy: Jerry Falwell, The Da Vinci Code, QAnon, and Jeffrey Epstein. This is a talk show by progressive Christians for… well, we don’t care wh...