Managing Up
44 episodes - English - Latest episode: 5 months ago - ★★★★★ - 22 ratingsManagement tips, stories, and interviews to help navigate the challenges of managing creative and technical teams.
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Episodes
What If Meetings… Were Good, Actually?
January 24, 2024 14:55 - 1 hour - 57.1 MBIn this episode of the Managing Up Show, Brandon, Travis, and Nick talk about meetings. How did they get a bad reputation? How can they be better? And no, the answer is not to abolish meetings, but rather to put the effort into making them actually good. They share disaster stories of meetings gone wrong and what makes one actually work. They cover: Setting a clear purpose for meetings Identifying the roles of participants, and Setting up discussions that unstick our work and sharpen our...
Moving Past "Hero Culture"
February 15, 2023 10:30 - 58 minutes - 53.6 MBNick, Travis, and Brandon talk "hero culture" and how that affects teams. What are the drawbacks of encouraging hero culture? How do you draw the distinction between necessary heroism and chronic hero culture? What's the difference between heroism and professionalism? They also discuss common pitfalls of trying to overcome hero culture, and what it means to set a sustainable example. Show Notes: Do Hard Things by Steve Magness https://www.amazon.com/Hard-Things-Resilience-Surprising-Tough...
Actually Managing Up
November 16, 2022 10:30 - 1 hour - 57.1 MBOK, fine, y'all win. We finally did the episode of "Managing Up" about managing up. In it, Nick, Travis, and Brandon talk about techniques for managing up, how they're similar to managing your own team members, and how it is sometimes very different. They share books and resources that helped them and talk about how communication, being crisp, and (gasp) _feelings_ play into managing your upward relationships. Show Notes: Managing Up article by Stephen Gossett from Built In https://builti...
How We've Changed the Way We Manage in the Pandemic, with Estella Gonzalez Madison
June 13, 2022 09:30 - 1 hour - 57.7 MBThe Managing Up Crew is joined by Estella Gonzalez Madison (@chicagoing) to discuss how they've changed the way they manage since the start of the pandemic 2+ years ago. They discuss tactical changes and how they've changed philosophically during this time, and how they square their own humanity and that of their teams during the last 2 years, as well as how this affects how they plan to manage in the future. Show Notes: Estella Gonzalez Madison https://twitter.com/chicagoing Talking to ...
Pain, Learning Organizations, and Trainwrecks
February 16, 2022 10:30 - 1 hour - 59.5 MBNick, pondering the Texas electric grid and the 2021 power crisis posits the question to Travis and Brandon: What role does pain play in leading teams? What is the role of a manager in managing and reacting to pain on our teams? What are the dangers of hiding or deflecting this pain? This leads to a discussion of processing feedback, helping teams learn from pain, and yes, launching trains at meteors. What roles do curiosity and fear play in managing organizational pain? What role do retrosp...
Accountability & Trust in a Distributed World
January 19, 2022 10:30 - 1 hour - 57.1 MBTravis, Nick, and Brandon discuss the word "accountability". What does it mean? Why has it developed a negative connotation? What's the connection between "trust" and "accountability"? They discuss the sometimes uncomfortable conversations that must take in place before a conversation about accountability can bring real results. They also talk about how remote culture changes the shape of this conversation by removing shortcuts some leaders have leaned on in offices. Show Notes: The Five ...
One on Ones: Beyond the Basics
September 29, 2021 09:30 - 59 minutes - 54 MBNick, Travis, and Brandon revisit the one-on-ones topic from several years ago and go beyond "1:1s 101". The hosts dive past the scripts and formulas to discuss challenges with regular one-on-one meetings with your team. How do you discern "gripe sessions" from a genuine request to intervene? When do you share context vs. listen? How do you get people to shift past surface-level concerns to the most important topics? What are some 1:1 antipatterns? Also: The group restrains themselves to onl...
"Marketing" Your Team as a Manager
July 07, 2021 09:30 - 42 minutes - 31.6 MBNick, Brandon, and Travis discuss the term "Marketing" and the myth that doing good work will speak for itself. How can you advocate for your team's work authentically without feeling like you're bragging? They talk about using tracking documents to track and showcase team accomplishments, and why it's important to demonstrate your team's impact, and not just their efforts. Episode links: Get your work recognized: write a brag document https://jvns.ca/blog/brag-documents/
Inviting Feedback and Creating Psychological Safety
June 16, 2021 09:30 - 53 minutes - 38.9 MBNick, Travis, and Brandon talk about how they increase psychological safety on teams to create space for a variety of voices, starting by debating the value of "strong opinions, weakly held". They explore the questions: How do you bootstrap trust and safety when joining a team? How can you make space for less vocal team members? What are things managers do that reduce trust within their teams? How can you encourage and receive important and valuable feedback? Episode links: Strong Opinions...
Is "Resources" a Dirty Word?
April 28, 2021 09:30 - 56 minutes - 51.7 MBIn this episode, Nick, Travis, and Brandon talk about the word "resources", thinking of humans versus abstract notions of people, and balancing company needs with individual needs. What changes as your role moves further from managing individual contributors? Show Notes GE's "Up or out" environment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitality_curve Episode 1: OKRs https://managingup.simplecast.com/episodes/podcast-episode-1-measure-what-matters The Passionate Programmer by Chad Fowler https...
Just Culture, Blame, and Accountability
November 11, 2020 10:30 - 43 minutes - 33.9 MBIn the last episode we recorded in the "before times", Nick and Brandon discuss the connection between blameless culture, systems thinking, and just culture. Nick explains how blame robs learning, and how to foster an environment that allows the system to learn and improve. They talk about how accountability fits into a blameless culture, and Nick introduces Sidney Decker's idea of Forward Accountability and shifting behavior rather than assigning blame. Show notes: Just culture https://e...
How Much Process Is Enough? How Much Is Too Much?
October 21, 2020 09:30 - 57 minutes - 44.3 MBIn another episode recorded in the "before times", Travis talks about finding the balance between not enough and too much process. Is Scrum too much process? How do you tell when process is designed to help versus be a remote control for a team? What if the process is being blamed for other problems? They discuss the signals that tell you when a process isn't working for you and when to modify existing processes versus throw them out. Notes: Extreme Programming Explained by Kent Beck http...
The Manager's Calendar
September 30, 2020 09:30 - 48 minutes - 36.8 MBIn an episode recorded in "the before times" that we feel is still relevant, Nick suggested we talk about what to do when you can't do it all. Nick, Brandon, and Travis discuss how the game of "Calendar Jenga" is symptomatic. What happens when your calendar is so full of "valuable" things that you have to choose between lunch or more meetings? Nick talks about using WIP limits to keep your calendar clean, and Travis talks about how designing your schedule is like designing teams. Notes: @c...
Getting Clarity in Times of Change
September 09, 2020 09:30 - 51 minutes - 37.7 MBTravis, Nick, and Brandon ask: what do you do when you have a sense that things are about to change? What about when your work evaporates due to a startup pivot or major organizational change? They talk about how to help maintain a team's composure and capability during times of uncertainty or lack of clear direction, including leaning on your own manager.
Breaking the Cycle of "Burnout Debt"
August 19, 2020 09:30 - 59 minutes - 45.6 MBBurnout is a very real problem right now, and is often aggravated in our jobs as managers, ironically in our work to help others avoid burning themselves out. Nick, Travis, and Brandon ask: how do you stop the cycle of overwork that led you to success in the first place? How do you take a break? Once you do, how do you come back to work? They discuss learning to set boundaries and say no, even to things we want. Travis compares burnout to technical debt. Nick explains how systemic thinking c...
Remote Teams, Coping, and Bringing Your Whole Self to Work
March 18, 2020 17:30 - 58 minutes - 53.4 MBNick, Travis, and Brandon talk about the chaotic and downright scary state of the world and our own prior adjustments to remote work. They discuss ways to lead authentically in these times, and how remote work has helped them learn how integrate life and work (and also, paradoxically, how to keep them separate). Show notes: Bringing your whole self to work https://mike-robbins.com/work/ CNN/BBC guy gets interrupted by child https://www.cnn.com/videos/world/2017/03/10/interview-interrup...
"Big Picture Strategists" vs. "Tactical Tornadoes"
February 20, 2020 10:30 - 1 hour - 43.8 MBTravis and Brandon talk about the tendency of software developers to fall into an "overly strategic" or "overly tactical" style of thinking. How do you encourage individuals and teams to consider both near and long term impact in their day to day work? How does team design factor in? What can you do if external factors are causing or aggravating these challenges? Is there a way to achieve balance? Show notes: A Philosophy of Software Design https://www.amazon.com/Philosophy-Software-Desig...
Seasonality and Rhythms in Engineering Teams
January 08, 2020 16:51 - 41 minutes - 30.4 MBNick, Travis, and Brandon talk about the seasonality of work and how that affects individuals and teams. They talk about how they work with low points in the cycle and how to capitalize on the high points, rather than fighting these cycles. How can you change the rhythm when things are flagging too much? What do you do when you can't move dates or deadlines around? When is it OK to ask the team for an "above and beyond push"? Notes: Shop Class as Soulcraft https://www.amazon.com/Shop-Clas...
Creating Self-Managing Teams
December 23, 2019 10:30 - 48 minutes - 38.5 MBBrandon asks Nick about a piece of advice he doesn't even remember giving about teaching teams to manage themselves. Nick, Travis, and Brandon explore tough questions around self-managing teams: How do you know when to let go and when to step in? What is the job of a manager on a self-managing team? How do you deal with micromanagement from above? How do you dig out if your team can't live without you?
Supporting Early-Career Devs and Defining "Engineer"
December 11, 2019 10:30 - 1 hour - 49.7 MBTravis and Brandon talk about how teams can support early-career developers and career changers. What environments are they a good fit for? How do you set expectations for newer folks? How can you help them get and stay productive? Is the cost of doing so worth it? They also talk about the surprising lack of definition around the space between "Entry-Level" and "Senior" engineers to define the main role that the rest are supposedly based on. They talk about the Dreyfus model of skill acquis...
Personality Conflicts and the "Us vs. Them" Mindset
November 27, 2019 10:30 - 49 minutes - 37.5 MBTravis, Nick, and Brandon discuss a tough-but-frequent listener question: "How do I coach senior developers and tech leads to work better with each other when they have opposing personality types or passions?" They explore the personality types of "ship it" vs. "perfect it". Brandon talks about what happens in the 1 out of 5 times when the conflict is ego- and control-driven rather than just slightly different values (hint: it's not great news). They discuss techniques to draw out the benefi...
Lessons from Captain Haynes
October 16, 2019 09:30 - 41 minutes - 32.9 MBNick pays homage to one of his heroes, Captain Al Haynes, who saved hundreds of lives by managing a crisis during a famous airplane crash. Captain Haynes demonstrated one of the canonical examples of Crew Resource Management and "just culture". They ask why we still adhere to the "unquestionable captain" myth and point out some of the (very public) disasters that created. Nick talks to the group about how he pivots into "questions/curiosity" mode from "assumptions/making a point" mode. They ...
Summer Vacations and Self-Care
September 19, 2019 09:30 - 50 minutes - 38.1 MBTravis, Nick, and Brandon talk about vacations after a summer full of them. When is it OK for managers to take vacations? How do you set things up to actually let yourself relax? What if something breaks while you're gone? Nick talks about the power of asking "When's the last time you took time off?" and how to clearly set the cultural expectations in "unlimited PTO" policies. The group discusses vacations as part of an overall self-care strategy. Notes: Nick's "self care" Twitter thread ...
Should I Care about "Manager READMEs"?
September 04, 2019 10:00 - 30 minutes - 23.9 MBThere is a healthy and active debate in the management community around Manager READMEs. Are they self-indulgent excuses for asking people to "deal with" your shortcomings? Or an essential tool to guide future conversations? Nick and Brandon explore the nuance in there and how their views about Manager READMEs have evolved (and continue to evolve) as they're exposed to more examples of them in practice. Notes: Jay Desai's Indespensable Guide for the Modern Manager https://firstround.com/r...
The Invisible Work of Management
August 21, 2019 10:30 - 48 minutes - 37.5 MBA thread on the "orange website" got Nick thinking: What are signs a manager is succeeding? What are red flags that they're on the wrong track? They ask the big question: How do you know when you are doing a good job? Are there any actual, useful measures you can use to know a manager is effective? And once you have an idea of what success looks like, how can we help scale that across an organization? Notes: The original HN thread about "What are the signs that you have a great manager?": ...
Building Trust with Teams
July 17, 2019 10:30 - 35 minutes - 28 MBNick, Travis, and Brandon explore trust as a pillar of successful teams. What does a high trust environment look like? How do you build trust? How do managers accidentally lower trust on their teams? How do you build (or rebuild) trust between a team and the rest of the organization? They relay the "marble jar" metaphor and explore what that means for teams. Show notes: John Cutler's trust flowchart https://twitter.com/johncutlefish/status/1144292646120120320 Turn the ship around https:...
Performance Reviews: When and How to Use Them
June 12, 2019 09:00 - 36 minutes - 28.5 MBThis week, Nick, Travis, and Brandon respond to a listener's question about when and how to successfully use performance reviews. Nick shares the idea of using "pattern matching" as a basis for evaluating performance. They discuss whether to tie performance to raises, and how to gather and provide feedback outside the performance review process. Notes: Listener question: I just had a fairly junior engineer ask in our 1:1 for something like a performance review. This is not something I - o...
How Do You Assess Technical Ability in Interviews?
May 29, 2019 10:30 - 40 minutes - 31.3 MBNick, Travis, and Brandon explore how they've tried to improve at assessing the technical abilities of potential hires during the interview process. They talk take-home tests, pair programming exercises, and Nick shares a technique that has worked better for his teams than either of those. Notes: Yahtzee problem http://codingdojo.org/kata/Yahtzee/ Trek Glowacki: "Tired: Engineering Interviews; Hired: Engineering Auditions" https://medium.com/@trek/tired-engineering-interviews-hired-engi...
Who's in Charge of Shipping?
May 13, 2019 21:18 - 37 minutes - 29.6 MBTravis, Nick, and Brandon talk about Rule #1 in running software teams: The Software Must Ship. How much of that is on you, the manager? They explore that question and talk about their experiences managing work backlogs, delivery cadences, and giving teams slack to help them go faster. Ron Jeffries's tweet: https://twitter.com/RonJeffries/status/1120486947569446914 Accelerate by Nicole Forsgren, et al. https://www.amazon.com/Accelerate-Software-Performing-Technology-Organizations/dp/1942...
Priorities, Impact, and Wrangling the "Manager's Calendar"
April 29, 2019 16:54 - 46 minutes - 35.5 MBNick, Travis, and Brandon talk about the vast array of "priorities" that can overwhelm a manager. The group talk through strategies they use to wrangle the "manager's calendar" and reclaim control over your time. Nick talks about how useful procrastination can be as a signal, and the group talks about using focus to make an impact in the face of "busy-ness". Notes: Effective DevOps https://www.amazon.com/Effective-DevOps-Building-Collaboration-Affinity/dp/1491926309 Managing Oneself by P...
Working Alongside Product Teams: What We've Learned
April 08, 2019 09:30 - 40 minutes - 37 MBNick, Travis, and Brandon talk about their successes and failures working alongside product teams. They discuss what keeps engineering teams from feeling empowered and how to avoid becoming an "onshore offshore" team. They talk about how to achieve collaborative, healthy tension between product, marketing, and design, and how this work is at the heart of good engineering management. Show notes: Lara Hogan's venn diagrams https://twitter.com/lara_hogan/status/966837809603600386?lang=en ht...
New Manager, Existing Team: Where Do You Start?
March 19, 2019 09:30 - 39 minutes - 36.6 MBTravis, Nick, and Brandon respond to a thought-provoking question about jumping in to manage a team that's already established. They also talk about what to do when the team needs culture or performance improvements. Amy Unger's question: "Walking into a new to you but established team, whether you were hired into a job or you got a team as part of a re-org, how do you approach coming into an established dynamic as a person of formal authority, but little knowledge or informal influence?" ...
"Being the Bull": What to Do When Words Have Weight
March 04, 2019 10:30 - 29 minutes - 27.3 MBNow that you're a leader, you may be surprised to find that your words sometimes carry weight that you didn't intend, feeling like the proverbial "Bull in a china shop". Nick, Brandon, and Travis share stories about this, and discuss power dynamics and how to shift power to the people who can actually do the work. Show Notes: Transforming the Difficult Child https://www.amazon.com/Transforming-Difficult-Child-Nurtured-Approach-ebook/dp/B079DT5TXT/ The Power of Moments https://www.amazon...
Estimation: Where Everything is Made Up and the Points Don't Matter
February 18, 2019 10:30 - 52 minutes - 48.4 MBEstimation is the bane of many software developers' existence. Nick, Travis, and Brandon discuss (and argue) about why estimation can be valuable, whether it's too expensive, and what you can do to help your team deliver consistent value whether or not you're expected to estimate software. We estimated this episode should last about 30 minutes, so naturally it's just over 50. John Cutler on twitter: Hybrid Kanban board https://twitter.com/johncutlefish/status/1080740227092639744 Scrum Gu...
Overcoming Crappy Leadership and the Illusion of Control
January 14, 2019 10:30 - 31 minutes - 29 MBWith Travis out this week, Nick and Brandon discuss a strongly-worded Twitter thread calling out bad leaders, what they've done that has and hasn't worked, and how listening and vulnerability play into more effective leadership (and parenting). Simon Wardley's Twitter thread calling out bad leadership https://twitter.com/swardley/status/1083124264142815233 Accelerate by Nicole Forsgren, PhD, Jez Humble, and Gene Kim https://www.amazon.com/Accelerate-Software-Performing-Technology-Organiz...
Transitioning into Management with Blithe Rocher
January 07, 2019 10:30 - 45 minutes - 42 MBBlithe Rocher, Engineering Manager at Fastly joins Nick, Brandon, and Travis to discuss how and when to transition to management, what to expect, and what advice she'd give her past self as she started managing her peers. Blithe Rocher https://twitter.com/blithe If I Understood You, Would I Have This Look On My Face? https://www.amazon.com/Understood-Would-Have-This-Look/dp/1524781924 Harrison Metal: General Management Course https://www.harrisonmetal.com/classes/foundations-general-ma...
Fearless Politics and Eiffel's Tower
December 17, 2018 10:30 - 39 minutes - 36.6 MBTravis and Brandon talk with Nick about his recent Lead Developer talk about Gustav Eiffel, the story of his iconic tower, and how that led to learning to fearlessly and authentically engage in "politics" to accomplish great things in your career. Eiffel's Tower by Nick Means https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RslVT-L2A40 You Can Negotiate Anything by Herb Cohen https://www.amazon.com/You-Can-Negotiate-Anything-Negotiator/dp/0553281097 Controversial tweet by Jason Fried https://twitter.co...
Engineering Ladders and Growing Developers with Sean Massa and Trek Glowacki
December 03, 2018 10:30 - 49 minutes - 45.3 MBEngineering leaders Sean Massa and Trek Glowacki join Travis, Nick, and Brandon to discuss what they've learned from their research on engineering ladders and growth tracks across dozens of companies. Hosts: Nick Means https://twitter.com/nmeans Travis Swicegood https://twitter.com/tswicegood Brandon Hays https://twitter.com/tehviking Guests: Sean Massa https://twitter.com/endangeredmassa Trek Glowacki https://twitter.com/trek Show notes: Rent the Runway engineering ladder htt...
How Technical Should A Manager Be?
November 20, 2018 10:00 - 33 minutes - 30.5 MBTravis, Nick, and Brandon discuss the technical requirements of being a manager, the cultural impact of a manager's technical skills, and why hiring engineering managers is so difficult. Notes: DevOps Transformation/ DevOps Handbook: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01M9ASFQ3/ The Effective Executive by Peter Drucker https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01F1WZGNC/
One on Ones: The Basics
October 30, 2018 09:30 - 33 minutes - 30.5 MBNick, Travis, and Brandon discuss the purpose of one on ones, how to help get the most from them, avoiding common pitfalls, and share resources on improving them for you and your team. Show notes: Radical Candor by Kim Scott https://www.amazon.com/Radical-Candor-Kim-Scott/dp/B01KTIEFEE/ Questions for your first 1:1 https://larahogan.me/blog/first-one-on-one-questions/ 87 Questions great managers ask https://getlighthouse.com/blog/one-on-one-meeting-questions-great-managers-ask/
CTO vs. VP Engineering: What's the Difference?
October 15, 2018 09:30 - 38 minutes - 35.2 MBTravis and Brandon welcome new co-host Nickolas Means, Engineering Manager at GitHub, to talk about the tracks in engineering management, and the differing roles and responsibilities of the CTO and VP of Engineering. Show Notes: Eric Brooke: Software Engineering Leadership https://ericbrooke.wordpress.com/2018/09/16/software-engineering-leadership/ Camille Fournier: The Manager's Path https://www.amazon.com/Managers-Path-Leaders-Navigating-Growth/dp/1491973897 Lara Hogan: Engineering L...
How do I become a better coach?
August 27, 2018 10:00 - 42 minutes - 39.3 MBTravis and Brandon discuss how central coaching is to quality management, the 2-way nature of coaching, and the critical role listening plays in becoming a better coach. HBR: The 9 Skills of Great Coaches https://hbr.org/2018/08/managers-think-theyre-good-at-coaching-theyre-not listening questioning giving feedback assisting with goal setting showing empathy letting the coachee arrive at their own solution recognizing and pointing out strengths providing structure encouraging a so...
The Manager's Job: Applying Google's 10 Traits
July 30, 2018 11:00 - 1 hour - 59.2 MBIn this super-sized episode, Travis and Brandon discuss what makes a great manager, using 10 skills and traits developed by Google's Project Oxygen and updated over the last 10 years. What is the job of a manager? We discuss the role of a manager with this Google-developed evaluation framework as a guide: https://www.themuse.com/advice/10-behaviors-make-great-google-manager https://rework.withgoogle.com/guides/managers-identify-what-makes-a-great-manager/steps/learn-about-googles-manager...
Measure what Matters: An Intro to OKRs
July 14, 2018 16:09 - 34 minutes - 31.3 MBTravis and Brandon introduce the podcast, discuss the book Measure what Matters by John Doerr, and talk about the value that OKRs can bring to a team. Notes: Measure What Matters: https://www.amazon.com/Measure-What-Matters-Google-Foundation-ebook/dp/B078FZ9SYB/ The Hard Thing About Hard Things: https://www.amazon.com/Hard-Thing-About-Things-Building/dp/0062273205 Radical Focus: https://www.amazon.com/Radical-Focus-Achieving-Important-Objectives-ebook/dp/B01BFKJA0Y ATX Web Show http://a...