“The day that you wake up, and you realize that you have been had, and the person you’re sleeping with is not the person you fell in love with, that’s the first day of your real marriage.” - James Framo. 

In this episode, my husband and I walk you through our journey through the four stages of relationship. From the initial spark of love without knowledge to the mature state of knowing love, we'll share insights into each stage and how they have shaped our 27-year relationship. Whether you're wondering why marriage is so hard or seeking ways to reignite the passion, join us as we delve into the intricacies of navigating these stages and finding grace in each one.

In this episode, you’ll hear about:

How Kurt and I navigated the four stages of relationships: love without knowledge, knowledge without love, the reckoning, and knowing love.Strategies we've used to navigate challenges and conflicts in our 27-year marriage.The three components of fostering intimacy and connection beyond the reckoningOur experience with embracing imperfections and growing together as individuals and as a coupleThe iterative process of facing yourself and your relationship with honesty and authenticity every day

And more.


“Marriage is a crucible that turns you into who you were meant to be... It's like a rock tumbler making gems beautiful, banging off the rough edges.”

I hope that you feel accompanied and supported, whichever stage of love you’re in now. My wish is that you will continue to be present to the mess and the mystery in the majesty of this wild, alive thing of being human with another human.


RESOURCES OR LINKS MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE:

Embracing Pain + Beauty with Special Guest Myra Sack

The Five Winning Relationship Strategies episode

The Five Losing Relationship Strategies episode

How to Stay, When to Go episode

100-Year Marriage episode


If the conversations on this podcast are resonating for you and you want to create the love, sex, and aliveness you desire with more ease, I invite you to enter a deeper relationship with me, through private coaching or my group mentorship program. Either way, you get powerful tools, conversation cheat sheets, meditations, and my loving and skillful attention every month, so your capacity for the pleasure and joy you want grows, continuously. CLICK HERE to apply for a consultation.

If the conversations on this podcast are resonating for you, please leave a rating and ideally a review on your favorite podcast platform.

Ready to bring about a transformation in your relationship to yourself, your body, and your partner? CLICK HERE to apply for a consultation.