Podcasting Conversations Worth Fighting Over [S3E18]

I had three difficult conversations yesterday. With each, I knew what I was getting into, so I had a little time to prepare. Before the fight gets too heated, or as quickly as possible can once the heat is on, I orient myself on understanding the worst that can happen. 

But not doom-and-gloom outcomes that aren’t probable. One way to avoid catastrophic thinking is to reframe it: What is the least acceptable outcome - to you - that can come from this?

Looked at from this perspective, the range of possible outcomes quickly narrows. Most often, the least acceptable outcome is a severing of the relationship. For me, losing a client - and the revenues they bring in - is the least acceptable outcome. But it is still acceptable.

Sometimes the difficult conversation isn’t with a client, but with the people we work with on the podcast. Maybe our cohost. Maybe a producer. Or maybe someone else who works behind the scenes. Once again, you need to know the least acceptable outcome before you do anything. 

As before, it might mean a severing of the relationship. And maybe that means you’re the one who leaves. That’s OK, as long as you have it as your least acceptable outcome. Clearly, if you own (or think you own) the show or a portion of it, then it’s a lot tougher for you to see leaving as the least acceptable, but still acceptable, outcome.

But it’s not always easy to walk away or show someone the door. One of the biggest challenges is entanglement. Before you unleash your least acceptable outcome, you need to think about the pain and suffering you’ll go through just getting them out of your system and processes.

If you’ve done some really dumb things like tied all clients together in a single hosting account, getting an ex-client’s show out of there is going to take effort and probably continued conversations with someone you don’t like working with! 

Similarly, if you need to fire someone from the team, how much havoc can they do until you get them unplugged? Do you have a plan for rescinding access - all access - in a moment’s notice? If not, you should.

For either situation, what sorts of written agreements exist, and what do they say about terminating the relationship? Is there a time-dependency that requires 30-days notice, for example? What about payments - future or past - owed or un-invoiced? And who owns what? Gaming this out now will save you a lot of headaches in the future. 

Not everyone has the luxury of kicking out a pain-in-the-ass client. When a client is responsible for 50% or 90% or 100% of your revenues, it may seem impossible to show them the door. 

Fortunately for me, my client roster is broad enough that I can survive the loss of a problem client. I’ve worked hard to eliminate every scrap of unnecessary entanglement precisely because of this reality. That allows me to quickly cut ties. Not every working podcaster is in a similar position of privilege, I understand. 

Some conversations are worth fighting over. Some aren’t. Keeping your focus on the end of the fight - your least acceptable outcome - can lighten your load when you’re in the thick of it.

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Read the full article and share with a friend: https://podcastpontifications.com/episode/podcasting-conversations-worth-fighting-over

Podcast Pontifications is published by Evo Terra four times a week and is designed to make podcasting better, not just easier.

Follow Evo on Twitter for more podcasting insights as they come.

And if you need a professional in your podcasting corner, please visit

I had three difficult conversations yesterday. With each, I knew what I was getting into, so I had a little time to prepare. Before the fight gets too heated, or as quickly as possible can once the heat is on, I orient myself on understanding the worst that can happen. 

But not doom-and-gloom outcomes that aren’t probable. One way to avoid catastrophic thinking is to reframe it: What is the least acceptable outcome - to you - that can come from this?

Looked at from this perspective, the range of possible outcomes quickly narrows. Most often, the least acceptable outcome is a severing of the relationship. For me, losing a client - and the revenues they bring in - is the least acceptable outcome. But it is still acceptable.

Sometimes the difficult conversation isn’t with a client, but with the people we work with on the podcast. Maybe our cohost. Maybe a producer. Or maybe someone else who works behind the scenes. Once again, you need to know the least acceptable outcome before you do anything. 

As before, it might mean a severing of the relationship. And maybe that means you’re the one who leaves. That’s OK, as long as you have it as your least acceptable outcome. Clearly, if you own (or think you own) the show or a portion of it, then it’s a lot tougher for you to see leaving as the least acceptable, but still acceptable, outcome.

But it’s not always easy to walk away or show someone the door. One of the biggest challenges is entanglement. Before you unleash your least acceptable outcome, you need to think about the pain and suffering you’ll go through just getting them out of your system and processes.

If you’ve done some really dumb things like tied all clients together in a single hosting account, getting an ex-client’s show out of there is going to take effort and probably continued conversations with someone you don’t like working with! 

Similarly, if you need to fire someone from the team, how much havoc can they do until you get them unplugged? Do you have a plan for rescinding access - all access - in a moment’s notice? If not, you should.

For either situation, what sorts of written agreements exist, and what do they say about terminating the relationship? Is there a time-dependency that requires 30-days notice, for example? What about payments - future or past - owed or un-invoiced? And who owns what? Gaming this out now will save you a lot of headaches in the future. 

Not everyone has the luxury of kicking out a pain-in-the-ass client. When a client is responsible for 50% or 90% or 100% of your revenues, it may seem impossible to show them the door. 

Fortunately for me, my client roster is broad enough that I can survive the loss of a problem client. I’ve worked hard to eliminate every scrap of unnecessary entanglement precisely because of this reality. That allows me to quickly cut ties. Not every working podcaster is in a similar position of privilege, I understand. 

Some conversations are worth fighting over. Some aren’t. Keeping your focus on the end of the fight - your least acceptable outcome - can lighten your load when you’re in the thick of it.

-----

Read the full article and share with a friend: https://podcastpontifications.com/episode/podcasting-conversations-worth-fighting-over

Podcast Pontifications is published by Evo Terra four times a week and is designed to make podcasting better, not just easier.

Follow Evo on Twitter for more podcasting insights as they come.

And if you need a professional in your podcasting corner, please visit SimplerMedia.pro to see how Simpler Media Productions can help you reach your business objectives with podcasting.

Mentioned in this episode:

Support For Abortion Rights

While Americans overwhelmingly support the right of an individual to make their own decisions about abortion, unfortunately, that right is no longer protected everywhere in the U.S. The Supreme Court overturned Roe v Wade on June 24th.

Abortion is a basic healthcare need for the millions of people who can become pregnant. Everyone should have the freedom to decide what’s best for themselves and their families, including when it comes to ending a pregnancy. This decision has dire consequences for individual health and safety, and could have harsh repercussions for other landmark decisions.

Restricting access to comprehensive reproductive care, including abortion, threatens the health and independence of all Americans. Even if you live in a state where abortion rights are upheld, access to safe medical procedures shouldn’t be determined by location, and it shouldn't be the privilege of a small few.

You can help by donating to local abortion funds. To find out where to donate for each state, visit donations4abortion.com.

If you or someone you know needs help, or if you want to get more involved, here are 5 resources:

1. ShoutYourAbortion.com is a campaign to normalize abortion.
2. DontBanEquality.com is a campaign for companies to take a stand against abortion restrictions.
3. Abortion.cafe has information about where to find clinics.
4. PlanCPills.org provides early at-home abortion pills that you can keep in your medicine cabinet.
5. Choice.CRD.co has a collection of these resources and more.

We encourage you to speak up! And spread the word.

This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:

OP3 - https://op3.dev/privacy
Chartable - https://chartable.com/privacy
Podsights - https://podsights.com/privacy