Enhancing the Hospitality Experience in XR, with UgoVirtual’s Michael C. Cohen

XR for Business

English - March 10, 2020 10:00 - 33 minutes - 30.7 MB - ★★★★★ - 12 ratings
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Previous Episode: IAAPA Update from Location-Based VR Expert, Bob Cooney

Next Episode: Building an XR Vocabulary for Businesses, with XR Bootcamp’s Ferhan Ozkan

Today’s guest — UgoVirtual’s Michael Cohen — describes the hospitality industry like a snowflake – add a little heat and, well, you can imagine. Hotels and cruises rely on proven practices to keep guests happy. Luckily, XR doesn’t have to disrupt those practices; they can build on top of them.

Alan: Coming up next on the XR
for Business podcast, we have Michael Cohen from UgoVirtual. We’re
going to be talking about how virtual/augmented/mixed reality
solutions — or XR solutions — can be used for front-of-house for
customer facing activations, from AR to VR. Pre-experiences, what is
it like to book this hotel, looking all around you? And also the
back-of-house: how do we use this technology to give the best
possible training for the staff, so that the customer experience is
flawless across the board? All that and more coming up, on the XR for
Business podcast, coming up next. Michael, welcome to the show, my
friend.

Michael: Thank you very much.
Really appreciate it, Alan.

Alan: It’s my absolute pleasure.
It’s been a long time coming. We’ve been kind of doing the dance,
watching each other grow. And I’m really excited to learn about what
you guys are doing in the hospitality field. It feels like it’s a
greenfield opportunity in hospitality, from travel/tourism. A bunch
of companies started with, “We’re going to put a 360 camera and
let you have a virtual tour.” But explain to us, what are you
doing at UgoVirtual, and what is the response so far in the
hospitality industry?

Michael: Well, first of all,
timing is everything, as we know. [chuckles] And the global travel
and hospitality industry is absolutely a greenfield opportunity. It’s
primed for scale and expansion in regards to XR. The reason being is
that there have been investments and there have been initiatives,
both on the brand and enterprise level of hospitality and travel
companies, but also in startups and larger companies who have
enabled, let’s call it a slice of VR or a slice of AR. Or as you
mentioned, enabled OK 360 hotel tours that were maybe derivative out
of the real estate market and that sort of scenario. Now, the
opportunity is very, very serious for UgoVirtual, because we are the
travel and hospitality virtual solutions company, very myopically
focused to both consult to the major travel and hospitality brands to
help them navigate and make investments and strategic decisions for
the next three, four, five years on what XR will be for them.

And also from our perspective, we have
a portfolio of XR oriented solutions that are very focused and linear
to the travel and hospitality space. So we’re not taking generic
solutions and trying to overlay them on travel and hospitality. The
group that’s involved with UgoVirtual — who I’m a strategic advisor
to — we’re all 15-20 year veterans on hospitality technology
commercialization for the front-of the house, which is guest facing
solutions and the back-of-the-house, which is employees and staff. So
when you overlay that kind of multi-decade experience on how to get
technology efficiently deployed, efficiently commercialized, exceed
the demands or the needs of travel and hospitality brands, with these
now slowly maturing VR/AR/XR opportunities, it’s a wonderful fit for
UgoVirtual right now.

Alan: So give us an example. You
talked about front-of-house, customer facing solutions. Let’s start
with front-of-house and then we’ll go back-of-house. Because I don’t
know if you know this, but I actually met my wife working at Delta
Hotels in Toronto.

Michael: [chuckles] That’s
perfect.

Alan: Yeah.

Michael: Thank you very much.
Really appreciate it, Alan.

Michael: [chuckles] That’s
perfect.

Alan: Yeah.

Michael: Yeah.

Alan: I was a bartender, and she
was the night manager–

Michael: That sounds like a
great novella right there. But that’s for another day.

Alan: [chuckles] It sure is.
Let’s talk front-of-house. What’s going on there?

Michael: Here’s the reality
about hospitality specifically and hotels, let’s be more even
granular. There’s obviously a massive investments of travel and
hospitality startups that are geared towards mobility, they’re geared
towards guest engagement, the guest experience, the ability for
guests to use their own BYOD smartphones to interact and to
experience property or a destination, for example. So there’s been
millions and millions of dollars invested — both at the brand level
and also at the vendor level — to enable mobile, for example. So
things like — I don’t know — mobile key access to rooms, brand
apps, et cetera.

Where UgoVirtual has identified a
couple of years ago and has been investing into initiatives, is the
virtualization of those type of experiences, the enhancements, the
scalability of those types of engagement experiences such as
virtualized hotel tours, deep virtual tours. They don’t require
headsets. They don’t require Hololens 2 for the consumer, but the
consumer through their mobile device, their tablet or at home,
through our solutions, through our virtual hotel tours that we are
fully rolling out in January of 2020. And we have some beta sites
already deployed all across North America. UgoVirtual hotel tours
solutions are very deep. They’re very much about the flow through a
hotel, experiencing the hotel, versus simply a 360 camera and some
sort of images.

The reason being is that hoteliers have
consistently over decades invested so much in the experiential design
and the look and feel and the feature function of their properties.
It’s an incredibly competitive market, like many other vertical
markets. And their investments in new builds and renovations are
massive and substantial. But this is all about the pre, the present,
and the post. The pre-virtualization of a guest experience. The
pre-experience of what it will be like to book this hotel, or book
their convention in this convention hotel, or book their meeting in
the meeting space, etc. is a massive benefit of what we call
hospitality XR from the front-of-the-house. And those are things that
we feel have been — in a limited fashion — enabled in the travel
and hospitality vertical.

But now we’re bringing out these
solutions that are far deeper, far richer, based upon technology that
you and I and others in industry know very well. But it’s all about
execution. So one major area is definitely the pre-virtualization of
travel or accommodations, so that consumers and the guests —
passengers of a cruise ship, for example — they have the ability to
differentiate and to make decisions on where they’re going to build
their travel itineraries, who they’re going to make their
reservations with, who they’re going to purchase services from.
That’s a massive opportunity that we’re very focused on executing in
the travel and hospitality space. That’s one major area of the
front-of-the-house.

The other area of the
front-of-the-house that we’re rolling out in 2020 as well is the
augmented reality experience within the guest room and the public
spaces of hotels or convention centers, etc. And we have invested and
are rolling out particular technologies that replace a lot of the
traditional content, printed content, even some of the digital
content that has been invested in by brands or travel destinations
over the last five, six, seven years, to make it a far more seamless
augmented reality digital overlay on the skin of the hotel or the
destination. That’s another area that you know well what I’m talking
about, and I’m sure the listeners do as well. Taking this augmented
reality interaction, these activations and actually focusing them on
the guest room. So we’ll be making announcements in January, February
on our next range of augmented reality solutions for hotels.

And then the last scenario that we very
much have commercialized and we’re rolling out is the virtualization
of events within the travel and hospitality space. But the reality is
that like any other vertical market industry, there’s a wide array of
industry events, of vendor events, of organization events that you
and I travel to many times, in many ways, in different verticals.
Well, we have a technology that we’ve commercialized over the last 18
months and we’ve already landed and are deploying multiple
virtualized events of brick and mortar exhibitors. And these are
industry related events in our space. There are organizational events
and there are also the vendor conferences for — for example —
hospitality technology vendors, who may have a conference every two
years because it’s incredibly expensive, quite challenging in regards
to bandwidth and time for the attendees and the vendors or the
speakers. So they may have these events every two years. Well, with
UgoVirtual virtualized events, they can have those events every year.
One year virtual, one year brick and mortar. And that’s really been a
major push crush. And we’ve had a lot of positive feedback on that as
well.

Alan: Watching the video, you’ve
basically created a system where you can have a virtual trade show,
looks like. And virtual meetings.

Michael: That’s exactly what it
is. Exactly.

Alan: So that’s not necessarily
in VR. I mean, you’re doing that on 2D screens. And so how is that
working out? What’s some of the response with that?

Michael: Well, we’ve generated a
lot of revenue, and we have multiple events signed and we’re rolling
them out in 2020. So I guess that’s the ultimate feedback from the
industry, is that people like us, they really like us, as Oscar
winners have said in the past. [chuckles] So, I mean, you can have a
vision, you can have an idea. If you’re executing in a vacuum, it’s
one thing. But when you’re executing and getting positive
reinforcement, and actual industry players are signing contracts and
investing in virtualizing their events, that’s the ultimate feedback
you can expect. And we’re still in a bit of a soft launch, because we
want to make sure that we’re executing very, very strongly on these
events. But the opportunity to go wide is really there, because
here’s the reality.

There are three areas of the travel and
hospitality industry globally where virtualized events from
UgoVirtual make a ton of sense. One is, obviously, our vertical
market industry organizations. There’s organizations called HTNG, for
example, that’s Hospitality Technology Next Generation. There’s
organizations called HFTP, which is the Hospitality, Finance and
Travel Professionals. These are — like any vertical market — these
are major organizations where we’re all members, and it’s an
important part of our careers. It’s an important part of training and
networking. And they all have very large user groups and work groups
and so on. So we are looking to talk to those people and move their
events — which we are all members of — to a virtual scenario
because you have an ability to expand reach, expand awareness, drive
actual interactivity between members of an organization or a vertical
market.

Because not everybody can travel to New
Orleans or travel to LA or travel to Monte Carlo. Not everyone can do
that. And no-one has the level in their career as an executive or a
decision maker, or they don’t have the bandwidth, or they don’t have
the travel budget. And secondarily and very importantly, what we’re
doing is also — as many of the people you interview — it’s also
green. This is a sustainability play, too. The ability to have more
events append existing brick and mortar events with UgoVirtual
virtualized event as a sister to the existing event is really
impactful from a sustainability perspective as well. Carbon
footprint, all those good thing.

Alan: Let’s shift focuses now to
the back-of-house. What are some of the solutions that you guys are
providing for back-of-house?

Michael: So in the back-of-house
space, we’re also a consulting firm, as I mentioned earlier. So we’re
focusing on assisting hospitality and travel brands on their strategy
for their employees, for their training scenarios, for optimization
of their back-of-house, human infrastructure. The reality of travel
and hospitality– And you were– now that you mentioned it, you
worked in this space. You know that turnover is massive. And that’s a
big challenge for hospitality brands, and ownership groups of hotels,
and conventions, and other scenarios. The turnover is massive. And
therefore, when that happens, a lot of the intellectual IP of how to
do what you need to do and your job in a hotel or in a conference
center or another hospitality entity, it evaporates. So there’s this
constant requirement for new hiring and training.

So taking the massive growth and impact
that virtual reality training is enacting in major North American and
global enterprise — as well as other vertical markets — we’re
bringing that to hospitality. So the back-of-the-house for us is very
much focused on VR and augmented reality training. So we’re
consulting with firms and we have relationships with the Microsoft
team in regards to Hololens 2, the HP team and their scenario. We’re
talking to Lenovo and many, many others who have both the hardware
and the cloud based infrastructure, so that hospitality and travel
companies can utilize this infrastructure, these tools to create
their own content, to be able to have a far more efficient, higher
retention and tremendous ROI on their training and back-of-the-house
staff. So that’s one area.

Another area that we’re involved in —
from an augmented reality perspective, in a product and deployment
solution — is creating the augmented reality overlays to the
physical plant of hotels or convention centers or mixed development
properties. The engineering manager of Hotel X been there for 15
years. He knows that the only way to get the boiler in the boiler
room to really kick in on the coldest day of the winter is you’ve got
to kick it twice and you’ve got to turn the lever to the right. He
leaves, he retires. That is gone. That knowledge is gone. I’m using a
very simplistic example, as you can imagine. But when you have an
ability to deploy a PIN code protected augmented reality overlay next
to the boiler, that has all this data, all this intellectual property
— knowledge — that’s permanently affixed in an augmented reality
scenario next to the boiler, it’s now there for the future. All
future employees or anyone who needs to have this information
available on the fly. So we are working on the back-of-house, as
well.

Alan: Kick twice and go down to
the back. [laughs]

Michael: Yeah. I mean,
obviously, when I’m using– I’m being pejorative and using a
simplified– but you know exactly what I’m talking about. And you’ve
seen it. And– I mean, listen, this is not always about inventing
something. It’s about taking best of breed solutions that are in
industrial and other enterprise scenarios, and overlaying it on a
very competitive, a very lucrative business called travel and
hospitality.

Alan: Well, it’s interesting.
Oil and gas companies have been doing this for a few years now.
Microsoft has really focused on enterprise. But when you see
“enterprise”, you think oil and gas, mining, construction.
But travel and tourism is an enterprise. Any group of companies where
you have millions of employees is an enterprise. So what are some
specifics? Like, what companies are rolling this out? What are what
are you seeing results wise? Is there any specifics you can share?

Michael: Sure. I mean, let’s
talk about on the front-of-house side of things. So Best Western,
about two to three years ago — major brand, huge portfolio of owner
managed hotels — made a mandate in order to roll out virtual hotel
tours to each of their Best Western properties. And it was well
accepted. It was a very good first major move. They’re one of the
first movers in the industry. It’s more of a 360 real estate type
experience, but it’s absolutely adequate and it has been adequate for
that period of time. And there’s been other brands that are more in
the boutique and independent luxury space, who have definitely done
the same. Where there is a next gen or next level is in regards to
really making these virtualized tours — like we are doing at
UgoVirtual — far more — what’s the word? — impactful and engaging,
and integrating them into different systems.

When you have a UgoVirtual tour of a
hotel, and you can embed in the actual booking of a hotel room from
one you’re– while you’re in the tour, or booking of a meeting space
through the RFQ interface of another system right within the tour. As
you know, engagement and activity. So that’s really where the next
level of what we’re doing in regards to the hotel tours. But listen,
Marriott has made investments. Hilton’s made investments. All the
major brands have had different levels of interaction in regards to
the tours. And we’re looking to — what’s the word? — maybe
aggregate some of that demand and bring out a very consistent,
deeper, richer, virtualized experience there. In regards to augmented
reality in the guestroom, the big, big push and the big deployments
have been different types of app-based or appless content and
interactive solutions in hotels.

I will say that we are in the early
stages, and our timing is great in regards to the augmented reality
overlay within hospitality. That is — again — an evergreen
opportunity. There has not been a massive amount of guestroom related
implementations. That’s why we feel we have a tremendous first mover
advantage and during our announcements in early parts of 2020, we’re
going to make sure we make the most of that impact. But what I will
say in regards to augmented reality in hospitality, there’s been a
lot of very successful activations by people like Foxwoods, casinos
and hotels, and other forward thinking brands and travel companies,
who have used it as more promotional and a way to do gamification
around their property, to have the guests or the consumers move
through the property to — for example — have a digital hunt where
you’re looking for different symbols or you need to collect the
activations of 12 different photos of Big Papi — former Boston Red
Sox, a DH — who’s obviously an ambassador for Foxwoods, for example.

So you have to go through the hotel and
you have to find all of the photos of Big Papi, and then use your
phone and activate the augmented reality experience. And when you do,
you get a bonus offer or you get points or you get a gift. So that’s
been really successfully rolled out in hospitality. And there’s the
beginnings of what we’re also involved in, is the AR activations for
the exterior of the buildings. So you’ve seen this in major brands in
the consumer packaged goods and consumer product space for using
these major neural activations. Well, that is starting to trickle
into the hospitality as well. Because these are buildings, and these
are buildings and resorts and convention centers, which have a ton of
external real estate — if you know what I’m saying — that the
activations of AR experiences are starting to trickle into there, as
well. And we’re involved in that, too.

Alan: It sounds like you guys
get your fingers and everything to do with XR and hospitality.

Michael: We’re focused still,
I’ll be honest, because we’re not a custom development shop, per say.
Yes, we’re a hospitality XR consulting company, for sure. But we have
selected and have invested in specific lines of business and
solutions, that we feel have the most opportunity for travel and
hospitality. One thing that’s really important, Alan, I think for
this conversation is yes, were a startup and in growth mode, for
sure. And we have interest from various parties to help us with our
growth. But we’re not– I’m not looking to belittle the traditional
startup cycle, but we are overlaying hospitality XR both for the
product and service to space and as consultants on the realities of
commercializing technology in travel and hospitality industry. We
know the budget seasons, the line items, how the widgets have to be
positioned from a commercialization and business model space.

That’s incredibly important, because
what we’re doing is we’re doing our own proprietary and we have
exclusive licensing on a range of technologies that we’re
commercializing globally in travel and hospitality. But we are
overlaying our own technology or licensed technology on existing
business models, that have been proven and are required over the last
30 years. And that is a big differentiator here, because as you know,
it’s hard enough to get buy-in authorities or C level folks to engage
and get behind a new technology. But if the business model or the
commercialization plan doesn’t align with what they’re used to, it’s
even another challenge. We have absolutely met that and exceeded that
scenario, because we know how to put the square peg in the round
hole, and roll out the technology in a way commercially that is both
viable, scalable, but also understandable to travel and hospitality
executives.

Alan: So if you’re speaking–
let’s say– assume that somebody from the industry is listening to
this podcast, what’s step 1 for them?

Michael: Well, step one for them
is– first of all, if you’re listening to the podcast, we appreciate
it. [chuckles] And second of all is, they’re digesting a lot of
information. There is a firehose that’s being blown into the travel
and hospitality space — like many other vertical markets, enterprise
markets — that these executives know they have to get on board. They
have to start crystallizing their strategy and their visions on how
in our industry hospitality XR — hopefully through UgoVirtual — is
enabled within their brands and their properties and their
destinations. So they’re already investigating. They’re already
collecting information. They’re reading, they’re watching. The goal
is there needs to be an alignment of this technology with what’s the
successful principles of their business. From our perspective– and
that’s why we’ve opened the consulting side of the business, because
we’re there to help them align those two important areas.

And then obviously, they need to
investigate what is the appropriate next steps if they’re interested
in front-of-the-house hospitality XR. What sort of areas or what sort
of feature function or benefits they want to achieve? What sort of
enhancements do they want to append to their existing successful
guest engagement scenarios? And those are things that have to be laid
out. And then they would talk to people like us, to help them
organize that, but also just to see what’s available in regards to
technologies that they can license, technologies that are scalable.

One thing you have to remember is that
in the major travel and hospitality brands, either destinations or
resorts or hotels or Disneys of the world, everything’s a thousand
points of light. It’s usually not one property or one destination. In
the enterprise side of travel, hospitality, it’s hundreds. It’s
thousands. There’s 14, 15, 16,000 hotels in North America, for
example. There’s hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of thousands of
guest rooms all over the world. That’s a big consideration. That’s a
differentiator from other industries. Yes, of course they have 200
locations, or they may have 50 training centers. These are all really
major accommodations that require a lot of planning a ticket to an
exponential level with travel and hospitality. That’s a critical,
important part of the successful identification, research, rollout,
and execution on hospitality XR: the thousand points of light. It
could be 50 points of light, could be a 1,000 points of light. But
that’s really important.

Alan: Let’s talk about– I do
want to bring up one company in particular, because they kind of been
flying under the radar. What are your thoughts on a company called
Oyo, who — from what I’ve heard — now are the number two hotel
chain in the world?

Michael: So we can have this
conversation regardless of hospitality XR, because this is really
important. So Oyo has a business model and has a system in place and
they’ve come out of Southeast Asia and Ritesh [Agarwal], their owner,
is a very dynamic CEO and he has major funding from Softbank, so he
has taken the traditional hospitality business methodology and he’s
put it on its head into almost like a technologies solutions company.
So there are great opportunities, great growth, but there are also
great challenges that they are facing. Hotels are hard. Every hotel
is a snowflake. It’s very challenging to scale traditional
hospitality surfaces, traditional hospitality technology, a server,
access points, IOT sensors, hardware. It’s challenging to roll that
out, because there are different configurations, different designs,
and different systems in place in every hotel in the world.

Alan: Oh, I know. Wi-Fi. Listen,
the hotel people that are listening to this: please, if you’re going
to work on one thing, Wi-Fi that works universally.

Michael: No, Alan, I mean, the
point is — you know this, I’m going to bring this back to our
conversation — is the consistency and the quality of Wi-Fi. I was–
I have been involved in Wi-Fi commercialization in travel and
hospitality for 15 years. And I worked with AT&T and other
leading hospitality Wi-Fi companies for many, many years. So I’m a
bit of an expert, barely stayed up at this one, I could say. And
you’re absolutely right. It’s a critical juncture. It’s like oxygen
for a hotel, because if the Wi-Fi is not consistent and the quality
is not there and the coverage is not there, it’s a real impact to the
guest satisfaction scores of hotels. And this is a good segue back
into what we were talking about.

Two things: guest engagement, guest
experience. So it’s front-of-the-house again. That’s where
UgoVirtual– and that’s where the virtualized and augmented reality
solutions that we’re bringing out, and the hospitality XR consulting
that we’re we’re delivering is key. Because this tsunami of XR that’s
going global, which you are a world expert at– and you know I’m not
kissing your behind, because I know who you are, we’re friends. And I
know the impact that you’re making around the world, and all the
travel that you do, and all the events you go to. So the tsunami of
XR in all different types of business and enterprise, it has its
place in travel and hospitality vertical. But what’s mission
critical, it’s not only about revenue and the retail environment,
it’s about optimization. It’s about revenue per square foot. It’s
about making sure that each aisle is activated in a way that can
drive more products to sell.

In hospitality, if you mess with the
guest experience, you’re in deep trouble. So the ability to
efficiently and intelligent roll out hospitality XR in our vertical
is incredibly delicate and also incredibly important. Guest
satisfaction scores are the cornerstone of a lot of the metrics in
general about hospitality. So that’s really critically important. But
second to that is, let’s talk about connectivity and let’s talk about
wireless connectivity.

Back to the Wi-Fi scenario. Wi-Fi 6,
5G. You know this, we’ve talked about this in the general sense, but
in hospitality and travel, it’s even more paramount. Because you have
massive concentrations of guests, passengers, consumers who are on
present — so this is the present part of UgoVirtual’s strategy —
they’re on premise. They’re interacting with the property, the
destination or the cruise ship. Any solution that’s deployed by us at
UgoVirtual — or anybody else in hospitality XR space — needs to
have seamless connectivity to make sure that experience is 100
percent, because if it’s not a 100 percent because the connectivity
is off, there you have the guest satisfaction challenges again. So 5G
and Wi-Fi 6 is the massive enabler to this next generation of
front-of-the-house and back-of-the-house solutions for travel and
hospitality. It’s a critical part of the success methodology for it.

Alan: Well, Michael, I really
want to thank you so much for taking the time to explain how XR is
going to be used for hospitality. If you look at just from the lens
of training people, I mean, that alone is a massive opportunity for
hotels. When I was in hotels, the training was not that great then.
And it really hasn’t improved since then. So being able to give
people the opportunity to train at a higher level, before they even
step foot into a property, I think is a really great opportunity for
these organizations.

Michael: There’s two quick
things I want to add — if I could — to that from the
back-of-the-house perspective and I’ll be brief, is in our industry
— like many others — the SOPs, the Standard Operating Procedures
are mission critical. And like you know, we know, but maybe not
everyone knows who’s listening to this. People like Wal-Mart and
FedEx and other major companies have made reasonable corporate
investments in VR training, for example. And they have realized
exponential ROI. Is that fair to say, Alan?

Alan: Yes. At least 10x what
they’ve put in.

Michael: Correct. I wanted you
to say 10x, because I don’t want to be the hypester. You’re the
expert. So what I’m getting at is in hospitality, the ability to
pre-qualify, pre-identify through the actual HR process of potential
back-of-the-house staff to interact in the actual experience of
implementing standard operating procedures and certain tasks — at a
hotel or a conference center or a cruise ship, for example — is
amazing, because you actually have ability to cull down to the best
cohort of your applicants and then you can get them into the company
and then you can train them very efficiently. As we know, with VR
training, you have higher retention, shorter training cycles and
major ROI. I mean, those are– that’s a winning scenario. That’s
really important. So the combination of SOPs with VR training and
working with brands and working with travel companies from a
UgoVirtual perspective, so they understand how to implement that on
the back-of-the-house is definitely part of our mandate and our
mission.

Alan: I’m really excited for the
future of what you guys are working on. And I’ll end on a quick
story.

Michael: Sure.

Alan: You know how Marriott
introduced VR room service, like VRoom service? So we actually
pitched them on that, and they took the idea and built it, and then
sent us one. So we got this briefcase where it was like a Gear VR and
a phone. And it’s like, “Look, VR room service!” I’m like,
“Oh, great, thanks.”

Michael: [laughs]

Alan: I was like, “Oh well,
it was a good idea.” But yeah, the hotels are really
experimenting with these things and it’s exciting. And hotels,
restaurants, everybody will be impacted by it. So thank you again for
taking the time to share this vision. Where can people find
UgoVirtual?

Michael: Sure. It’s
ugovirtual.com, and in LinkedIn just search for “ugovirtual.com.”
And we are the travel and hospitality virtual solutions company.

Alan: Thanks so much, my friend.

Michael: Alan, a pleasure. And
look forward to seeing you in the future at the next major event.
Thank you for this time today. Appreciate it.

Alan: Sounds good.