Kajsa Balkfors is the former (very successful) CEO of Cirkus Cirkör that has dedicated her life as a practicioner to practice the art of living in community, hosting and most recently she's worked with liberating kids in the Swedish preschools through Tillitsverket. Ola Jubelin is a friend and a skilled facilitator that you can find at facilitatingchange.se. This is a conversation between practitioners. We speak about change, what it is and how it differs from the new. The distinction between change and growth. Most of all however we speak about what is possible when we fill existing structures, like the preschool, with new content and how that has the potential, like in Kajsas case, liberates both kids and pedagogs. Enjoy the conversation!