The Joyous Dance of Humility and Magnanimity: Jennifer Herdt on Virtue and Joy

How shall we approach seemingly opposing virtues of humility and magnanimity? What happens when our view of self is too low or too high? Professor of Christian Ethics Jennifer Herdt discusses the balancing act between what St. Thomas Aquinas penned the "Twin Virtues": humility and magnanimity.

How shall we think about the apparent conflict between the call to humility and the call to greatness and honor? Is it demeaning to be humble given that we are made in the image of God? Or is humility it the ultimate regard for humanity? How can we put on Christ without being guilty of "acting" or "faking it"? How can we be magnanimous, or have greatness of soul, without pride interfering? Professor of Christian Ethics Jennifer Herdt responds to these questions and helps us navigate the balancing act between humility and magnanimity.

Show Notes

0:00—Podcast intro
3:49—Begin interview, Jennifer's intellectual conversion story
4:44—Herdt's Putting on Virtue: The Legacy of the Splendid Vices book and putting on Christ vs. "faking it"
7:53—17th century interest in virtue
9:52—The court and virtue vs. performance to influence
10:43—Reference to Socrates' concern for reality vs. appearance
11:54—Reference to Rousseau
12:24—Unpacking Augustinian phrase "splendid" or "glittering" vices
16:42—Humility as a virtue or as a vice?
20:00—Modern critiques of humility as a virtue
23:04—Friedrich Nietzsche's perspective on humility
25:24—Interlude 1
26:42—Historical and philosophical views of magnanimity
31:55—Balancing magnanimity and humility; Jesus as the exemplar
35:14—The "great things" that we are called to
36:05—Interlude 2
38:25—Infused vs. acquired virtues
42:30—Goodness by imitation or hypocrisy?
44:36—Jesuit theatrical tradition, reference to book Silence and feature film Silence
47:33—Humility and joy
51:30—End interview, credits

Quotes from Jennifer Herdt

"We are called to befriend the sinner and the outcast. We're called to relationship with one another. We're called to connection. Pride separates us from that connection. Insecurity separates us from that connection."
"If humility enhances friendship because it takes down those barriers that separate us from one another in our tendency to always compete with and compare ourselves to one another, then humility is a path to friendship."

Credits

The Table is sponsored by generous grants from the John Templeton Foundation, Templeton Religion Trust, and The Blankemeyer Foundation
Theme music is by The Brilliance
Production and engineering by The Narrativo Group
Edited and mixed by TJ Hester
Production Assistance by Laura Pelser
Special thanks to Jennifer Herdt
Evan Rosa on Twitter
CCT on Twitter