Episode 111: Stacey Harris

Stacey Harris is marketing strategist working with entrepreneurs who are tired of spending hours online with no results. Through her podcast, membership community, and agency she supports frustrated leaders in getting results online by building connection.

Introducing Stacey Harris

Stacey Harris is marketing strategist working with entrepreneurs who are tired of spending hours online with no results. Through her podcast, membership community, and agency she supports frustrated leaders in getting results online by building connection.

Show Notes

Website | thestaceyharris.com

Podcast | hitthemicbackstage.com

Twitter | thestaceyharris

Facebook | thestaceyharris

Instagram | thestaceyharris

Linked In | thestaceyharris

Preferred Pronouns | She/Her

Episode Transcript

Tara: This is Hallway Chats, where we meet people who use WordPress.

Liam: We ask questions, and our guests share their stories, ideas, and perspectives.

Tara: And now the conversation begins. This is episode 111.

Tara: Welcome to Hallway Chats. I’m Tara Claeys.

Liam: And I’m Liam Dempsey. Today, we’re joined by Stacey Harris. Stacy is a marketing strategist working with entrepreneurs who are tired of spending hours online with no results. Through her own podcast, membership, community, and agency, she supports frustrated leaders in getting results online by building connections. Welcome, Stacy.

Stacey: Hi, thanks for having me.

Tara: Hi, Stacy, we’re really glad to meet you. Thanks for joining us. Can you please tell us more about yourself?

Stacey: Sure. In addition to running my business, I’m also a mom and a wife, and I live in Southern California. I generally can be found either in the office at Disneyland or at the beach. And that’s pretty much the entirety of my world.

Tara: Wow. So Southern California is a good place to be for you then.

Stacey: It is. It is a good place. I grew up in Phoenix, Arizona, which is quite hot. So we spend just about as much time as possible not inside. Kind of always out somewhere.

Tara: That’s great. You spend a lot of time with entrepreneurs, and so you are also an entrepreneur. Can you tell us a little bit about your journey to becoming that? Have you always work for yourself or what’s your path?

Stacey: I’ve worked for myself for about eight years. I do not come from entrepreneurial stock. My parents are both in law enforcement, and before that my grandparents worked for school districts and telecom companies. Very much so like you work 25 years, you get a pension kind of people. However, I am a terrible employee. I don’t respond well to being bossed around, and I don’t like to follow a bad plan, which corporate is full of.

It’s funny, I tell my team regularly, the one answer we do not accept is we do this because it’s always been done that way. It is the one answer you’re not allowed to give me. I don’t care how long we’ve done it some way. If there’s a better way, let’s do it that way. I’ve owned my company for about eight years. It’s gone through quite the journey.

I actually started as a virtual assistant, mostly because I’d had my son, who was about two years old. I had been staying at home. I’m not built to be a stay at home mom, it takes somebody way cooler than me. I missed the part of my brain that functioned independent of a child but I didn’t really have any desire to go back to work. My degree is in audio engineering. I had worked for a record label in Phoenix before I had my son, and I didn’t really want to go back to doing any of that long hours and late nights in studios and whatnot.

And so I was like, “I wonder what I could do.” And so I googled one of the top five worst things to Google, which is “work from home.” It’s worse now than it was then. But it’s just no good thing comes from googling “work from home.” I googled that, and I learned that virtual assistants were a thing. So I was like, “I’ll try it.” Eight years later, I own a marketing agency and we run a training site to teach people how to DIY their own digital marketing.

I’ve met some of the most incredible people. All of my best friends at this point of my life are also entrepreneurs. I have a really good time with it. But no, it is not at all what I would have said in high school, “Oh, I’ll own my own business.” It did not occur to me as an option.

Liam: There’s a lot to unpack there. I want to ask you a little bit about being a terrible employee and don’t like to follow a bad plan. I heard some things in there that I probably say about myself. You talk about a team that you have at your company now. How does that work than where you know, your own approach is, “I don’t like bad plans, I’m not a good employee but you need good employees, you don’t need them to follow bad plans? But how does that work? How do you craft that? How do you respect their individuality, but also, you know, we’ve all got to row the boat the same way or we’re not going to get where we need to go?

Stacey: It’s funny because I resisted having a team for a very long time because I thought I would be a bad boss because I’ve had so many bad bosses. I mean, I think we’ve probably have all had terrible bosses. I had a real fear around this idea of being in charge of other people. I have a hard enough time being in charge of myself, I don’t know how I’m going to be in charge of anybody else.

But what I have found is communication like in any relationship form is kind of critical. I set the bar very early that if you disagree, if you have a thought, if you have an idea, I want to hear it. That’s the highest value you can bring to the team. I think we’ve all had the boss who gives on the first day their speech about their open-door policy, and then you’re like, “I’m not coming to you with anything.”

So I’m very conscientious that when the team comes to me with something that I’m listening. I’m going “Cool, tell me more.” And sometimes we go with it. But also, there is an understanding and agreement that I established very early that at the end of the day, I’m the captain of the boat. I’ll listen to your decision. And generally, we end up with some version of a high. Sometimes I tossed my plan out the window because my team comes with a way better idea, which is, you know, that’s what we hire for people smarter than us, right? But usually, it ends up with some sort of like mash-up of the two plans that’s way better than either of us would have come to you independently.

And that’s what I like most about having a team because I think it’s really easy for us to keep following a bad plan because it was our plan, and so we have some sort of attachment. I have no attachment to my plan. All I have attachment to is the end result. That, for me, I think is the most valuable thing as a leader. I don’t care how we get there just as long as it gets done. If it gets done the client’s happy, the project is successful, cool. I’m completely unattached to the roadmap that got us here except for like let’s keep it so we can use it again.

For me, it’s definitely let’s talk, let’s find out why. Communication, communication, communication. Like any relationship, that’s the most important. It was also a clarity that at the end of the day, I am the boss and I get to go, “No, I don’t wanna.”

Tara: One of the hard things about being a boss might be finding the right people to work for you and making decisions about people that maybe aren’t the right fit for you. It sounds like you have a team that you enjoy working with, the way you’re talking about them. But can you talk a little bit about your process for finding people and how you might handle people that aren’t performing the way that you expect them to?

Stacey: I think to exasperate my fear of being a boss when I launched the agency was an experience in the past in growing my business, where I had people on my team doing different things to support my business, that weren’t a great fit. Because I was like, “Well, maybe I’m just a terrible…” It really feeds that maybe I’m a terrible boss mentality.

So for me, it is definitely – and this is straight-up all advice I have been given and I’m going to steal right now. So this is no new ideas here. This idea of fire fast, hire slow, that’s been really key for me. We start everybody with a project. We don’t start with, “Hey, you’re on the team, and this is all the things you do now.” We start everybody with a project. If we can’t get through our projects, we’re not going into a larger relationship.

That’s how we work with our clients too. All of our clients start with a strategy project. If you don’t go through the strategy project, you don’t get retainer services from our agency. Because everybody needs to know that it’s the right fit. Everybody needs to know that we want to end up the same place and that we kind of work in a way that is complimentary. I won’t say the same way because I don’t think a team full of me’s would be wildly valuable. I think the fact that there’s only one me is probably for the best for everybody. But this idea that we always start with a project, we always test out not just proficiency, but personality, that plays such a part. So we always start with a test.

I also as often as possible, try and get recommendations from people or I have stolen people from others teams and been like, “Hey, I know you’re freelancing with them, but I’m looking to bring somebody in pretty full time. What do you think?” Which has always been okay with the person I stole them from. But let me be clear, I’m not like poaching in a mean way. But for me, it’s definitely personality over proficiency. We’ve trained pretty much everybody who’s on the team to really do things my way. That’s where the ‘I’m the captain of the boat’ then comes in. But yeah, personality, making sure they’re a good communicator.

Generally, I have some sort of like weird manipulative tests during the application and test project where I’ll screw something up and I’ll see if they’ll bring it to me, or how they’ll bring it to me. Because I have to know that you can be confident enough in your abilities to come up to me and say, “I don’t think this is right.” Because if you can’t tell me something I did was wrong, we’re going to have a problem because I’m going to do things wrong. I am human. I will screw. I will leave instructions out, I will forget to tell you the middle step which is why when I give instructions, it’s usually a video of me doing it because if I tell you I for sure miss the middle three steps that are just like muscle memory at this point. But yeah, I think personality and ability to come to me with something that might be less than comfortable are the two things I probably look for the most.

Tara: Your employees, are they remote? Are they local near you?

Stacey: They’re remote, which I actually really, really like because it allows us…Like I said, I’m on the west coast. Some of my team is on the East Coast. We have a lot of clients on the East Coast. It allows us to sort of have somebody around no matter what time it is. If something hits the fan at 4 am my time, great, my team is around-ish or will be soon because they’re in the office at 7 or 8.

Again, I don’t have a huge attachment to how things are done. So I don’t need people to be in the office with me from 9 to 5 to get a project done. I don’t like that. I have a separate office from my house. So at some point, maybe we might have people in the office. But for right now, everybody is remote, which for right now I really like.

Tara: Can you tell us a little bit about your connection with WordPress? We do talk to people who we connect with here, we don’t necessarily talk all about WordPress, but we connect with them because they use WordPress. So can you tell us a little bit about that? You use that in your company or personally?

Stacey: Yeah. The entirety of my business is really built on the back of WordPress because our membership site is built on WordPress, my sites are all built on working. I got started with WordPress, oh my goodness, probably eight years ago when I started the business. I built my first site on WordPress. I for a long time as part of my virtual assistant services offered WordPress support and management.

I am what I would classify as sort of a power user. I’m by no means a designer and/or developer but I can solve a problem or at least identify the problem enough that we can bring the right person in to fix it. But I’ve built everything I’ve ever had on the internet, the home base has always been on WordPress. So for me, without WordPress…I mean, I’m sure without WordPress, I would have found another solution. But it’s my shop. It’s my sign in the world.

Liam: Are you involved with your local WordPress community?

Stacey: Not here in Southern California. But I was in Phoenix. I spoke at WordCamp Phoenix, oh gosh, three times in the last five-ish years. At WordCamp Phoenix. My best friend actually runs a meetup in Phoenix for WordPress. So I’ve been to that and I’ve spoken at that a couple of times. So yes, I’m very involved…not WordPress in Southern California because I never actually met up with anybody here. But in Phoenix, yes. They are responsible for all of the things I know how to do mostly. Because I would break something and be like, “Come help me.”

Tara: There are a lot of marketing people who use WordPress as you’re describing it but I’ve been to plenty of meetups where the topics are not WordPress-oriented – WordPress meetups, where the topics are more marketing strategy, social media. How did you learn how to do what you do with marketing and the strategy that you do?

Stacey: Some of it is trial and error, I’ll be honest. Some of it is, “let’s see if we can break sort of like WordPress. Let’s see if this breaks it. Okay, it didn’t. I don’t have to restore the backup. We’re good.” But a lot of it is trial and error.

It’s funny. Like I said, I started as a virtual assistant and I found that I really liked the social media stuff. I remember as I was doing this thing, and starting this, that when I was in school, that was my first job in the music industry was I went and found bands and tried to get them to submit to a web radio station that my boss was launching. And by the way, this is pre any modern music service. This was like an HTML player embedded on a website. This is like the days of Myspace. That’s what I used Myspace for was to basically connect with these bands between shows and say, “Hey, I’m coming to see you. Can we talk?”

Because, a, I was a 19-year-old girl. And when a 19-year-old girl goes and walks up to boys and bands and say, “Hey, I really liked your music, do you want to submit to the station?” they do not believe you. So you need some credibility and having connected with them previously, and been like, “No, I work for this label. We want to dah, dah, dah.”

So I realized that I had kind of always used these tools for some sort of business end. There was a purpose to it. it was not just amusement. And so I was like, “Oh, I really like that. Let me explore that.” So I played a lot. Then I started offering services to clients and saying, “Hey, I want to see if I can replicate this working with this system sort of outside of my business.” If I’m doing this for someone else does it still work? And it did. So we kept doing it.

Social media specifically changes so quickly, that you’re kind of always just testing. You’re kind of always seeing what’s going on work now. So we still kind of just see if we can break stuff, see if we can get something to work better than it did before.

Liam: I like that, that let’s just see if we can break stuff. That seems a good metaphor for life.

Stacey: It’s true.

Liam: And speaking of life, let me ask you one of our questions that we like to ask all of our guests. And it’s around success. Stacy, how would you define success? And it can be a mixture of personal or professional definitions.

Stacey: I describe success in sort of the same way I describe this idea of work-life balance. If I get to be 100% present in whatever I’m doing right now, I’m cool. If I can be 100% with my family when I’m with my family and 100% working when I’m working, that for me is success. I don’t have to be pulled in all the things I should be doing or could be doing instead.

I think presence for me is really, really critical. And I think that that comes from really intentionally and successfully building a life you want to be living. Otherwise, you tend to be thinking about the things you’d rather be doing than the thing you’re doing. And I won’t lie, occasionally I have to like, I don’t know, go to a parent-teacher conference that I’m not super excited about. Parents don’t want to attend any more what the children do. They’re not super fun times. But I get to be 100% present to it. I get to be 100% in that moment. I don’t have to be thinking, “Oh, I have to leave here in three minutes so that I can make it to my office before my boss finds out I’m late.” I don’t ever have to be in that moment. That to me is success.

Tara: I would think that there’s also some challenges associated with that, especially with the kind of situation that you’ve described and when you first introduced yourself and talk about yourself being a mom. Can talk a little bit about balancing that? Because when you’re working for yourself, there’s also kind of no expected end time of the day and start time of the day, and there’s no maybe consistent paycheck. So what kind of challenges do you face being an entrepreneur and maybe combining that with being a mom?

Stacey: I think that when you’re a parent, mom or dad, I think there’s always this, am I doing enough? Am I doing this right? And I think when you’re an entrepreneur, there’s also a fair amount of am I my doing enough and am I doing it right. So there’s a fair amount of you always in this constant, like conversation with yourself around enoughness. Like, “Is this going to work?” I think that’s a weird thing we have to sort of navigate in our brain.

My son is 10. He’ll be 11 in October. I started the business when he was two. He doesn’t remember a time where I didn’t do this. That helps I think because it’s just normal for him. I’ve also always been obnoxiously honest with him. When I make a big decision, when we choose to…

Here’s an example. We retired my husband four or five years ago. 2015. That’s four and a half years ago. Before we did that, we sat down as a family and had a conversation. Here’s what this means, here’s what this might result in. And we all got to vote. He gets to vote like everybody else. When I’ve made investments in my business and masterminds or bringing on team, he sits on the board of directors, and we sit down and we talked about it. So he’s invested in what’s happening, which I think makes it a little easier when I’m in those seasons of business or life, where I am working a bit more than I would prefer to be working. When I do go directly from the office to wherever the thing was, I’m not home, wherever the soccer game, whatever kid event thing there is instead of coming home and having dinner and talking about it and going together.

I don’t take him to soccer practice. I don’t take him to scouts. My husband does that. Charles is my husband. Charles is usually the one at home when he gets home from school. So it helps that Charles is a full-time dad, and he still has that solidness. Also, I’ve been doing this long enough, and I built my business very intentionally so that most days I am home when he gets home.

I built a hard stop into my day recently, because I was having a harder time stopping working. I’m somebody who my family saves my life, I am workaholic by nature. I would just work. I would just live in my office and work all the time if left to my own devices. And so we build in things that sort of forced me to be done at the end of the day so that I can go and be with them.

Then I come back to this idea of presence. It’s not about balance. It’s not about equal. It’s about when I’m there, I’m all the way there. But on the flip side, when I’m heading to a She Podcasts LIVE in October to speak, when I’m there, I’ll call once a day. That’s it. I’m there. I’m not, “Hey, Mom, where’s my belt? No, talk to your dad. This is not a mom duty time.” And I think that’s helpful. He knows those rules. He understands those rules. He understands why because he’s so involved in the conversation. But on the flip side, when I’m with him, I’m not checking my phone. I’m not in Slack with my team. I’m not on social. I’m 100% with him. He has my undivided attention. So I think that helps more than trying to strike the balance.

Tara: For sure, yeah, it’s hard to get to that point. It sounds like you’ve achieved it. Has it always been that way or have you learned that? Did you use to have your phone out or have you always been that way?

Stacey: It’s a moving target. Some days are better than others?

Tara: Okay, good. just clarifying that you’re not a perfect saint.

Stacey: No. Like parenting, some days you end the day, and you’re like, “Well, that didn’t go well.” And some days you’re like, “Oh, I really, really wanted that today.” Again, I think I do a pretty good job of being aware with kind of what’s happening. But absolutely, we’ve been through those seasons of life in business where we’re launching something or we’ve got clients who are launching something, and it just needs more of my attention than it normally does. We’re still building out the team to remove me more and more from the client stuff. But there are times when it’s like, “Well, no, I’m going to work till 7 or 8 o’clock tonight because this project has to be done. And that’s the way it is.

Tara: You mentioned a membership site, do you have a membership site? Can tell us a little bit about that?

Stacey: We do. We’ve got a site called Hit the Mic Backstage. My podcast is called Hit the Mic and the membership is called Hit the Mic Backstage. It’s essentially the next level of the podcast. We teach strategy in there, we teach how to analyze your results, because if you aren’t looking at the numbers you can’t make the best next decision. We’ve got guides on how to use Instagram and Facebook and LinkedIn and Twitter and sort of how to use…we have a how to launch a podcast guide. We’ve run it for four years now on WordPress.

I think the biggest reason we’ve had some of those members who joined us from the beginning stay is it sort of you’re trusted resource of what’s new. So when Facebook makes a change to the algorithm, or Instagram has a new feature, my members is having a place where they can go, “Hey, do I need this? Hey, do I need to pay attention to this? Hey, do I need to be freaked out?”

Because unfortunately, there are a lot of people who do what I do, who are really in the fear business, who are really in the business of scaring entrepreneurs into thinking that they’re the only ones that hold the solution. I hate that. It drives me absolutely crazy. I don’t think anyone makes a good decision-based in fear. It’s my job to give them information, pros, and cons of something, and let them do what whatever they’re going to do.

And so we often have discussions in there, “Hey, this new thing is live. I know so and so said I need to be doing it.” Let’s say Facebook Live, for example, you know, “so and so said I have to be doing Facebook lives every day. Do you think that’s true?” “No. Will your audience watch you on Facebook Live every day?” If they won’t, you don’t need to. I very rarely do Facebook Live. You want to know why? My audience won’t watch them. They’d much rather listen to a podcast while they’re walking their dog than deal with Facebook Live.

Sometimes I will get them to turn on the Facebook Live and shove it in their pocket and listen to it as if it’s a podcast. But I’m not getting them to sit down and engage with me for a 30-minute video on Facebook Live. That’s just not my audience. And so we talked a lot about what’s right for you, instead of this is the only way to do it box of this is right and this is wrong.

Liam: Yeah, I think that’s really valuable with social media because things are constantly changing and very rarely are the businesses, at least that I work with, do they need to be cutting edge. So well, let’s make sure Facebook Live takes off before we even start to think about it. There’s so many places to be on social media. That’s just not possible. There’s only so much outsourcing of social media you can do. At some point, the company just has to do it. You can’t outsource a live video of the Director of Product because then it won’t be the Director of Product. So yeah, I like your approach. I respect that a lot. I think you’re right, there is a big challenge in digital marketing where “Oh, you have to be everywhere all the time and on top of the trends.” Well, maybe if you’re Beyoncé. Maybe. I don’t know.

Stacey: No, people will just go Beyoncé and that will be anywhere. It’s true. That’s a question I get into question I get a lot. “Do I have to be everywhere?” We always talk about the rules of two. Choose two primary networks. These are the networks you’re going to show up most days, these are the places you’re going to prioritize, these are the places you’re going to schedule a foundation of content so that if you don’t show up, something happens.

What I mean my show up live is not necessarily a live video, but you’re going in and you’re engaging with comments, you’re posting sort of what’s happening, those kind of things. Choose those. Rock those. The reason I say two instead of one is when Facebook makes a change, or Facebook goes down, we have someplace else they can find you besides your website. They know of another place to find you. Pick two.

Once you have two and you’re really nailing to then yeah, let’s maybe we can add some support pieces. We call those secondary networks. That way, if something happens to one of the primary networks, we have a secondary network we’ve kind of been working on, we can slide into that place. But we don’t even talk about those until you’re nailing two networks.

Tara: Your membership site and all this advice that you’re sharing, that’s actually for people who log into your site. I’m curious because I know a lot of companies have chosen a Facebook group because people are already logged in there and aren’t going to go login somewhere else. So where are they joining?

Stacey: All the content in a private forum exist on one side, hitthemicbackstage.com. All of it lives there. We do also have a Facebook group for people who are maybe on Facebook, and they can share in there, “Hey, I just saw this post, do I need to know?” We have that as well. But we also have everything you would need inside of one environment on one site. Because again, and this is something I think a lot of membership site leaders and business owners they’re giving a lot of attention and time to building a Facebook group, which is awesome, you’re building a community, I’m absolutely pro community. However, if Facebook decides they don’t like your group or something, or Facebook goes down, those people have no place to go.

So we do have a forum on site, along with all of the trainings in one place, so that we’re completely self-sufficient as it were. We’re completely self-housed sort of off the social media grid should social media go down? I mean, we’re still screwed if the internet goes down, because you know, it’s the internet. So we’re not reliant on Facebook.

Tara: Well, that fits in with the WordPress open source own your stuff mentality as well. So I can definitely appreciate that. Stacey, we like to ask our guests about advice. Can you share with us some advice that comes to mind that sticks out? Something that’s meant a lot to you and that you’ve implemented in your life?

Stacey: I think for me, the reminder that I get most often is you’re in charge. I think as entrepreneurs and in business, we get a lot of advice from mentors or coaches or other people in the space. And it can feel like we need to go down their road because their road was successful for them, or in the case of social media, their road looks like it’s successful for them. But at the end of the day, we have to make our own choice. We have to figure out what’s going to work for us. That means a little bit of trial and error, it comes back to this idea of can I break it?

But I think ultimately we have to take ownership of our own decisions. And maybe that’s just a human thing that if we all agree just took ownership of our decisions a little more often it would be a better place. But I think for me, that’s the thing that I remind myself of, and that I heard early in my business the most often is you have to make the decision that’s right for you. Sure, go and get nine kinds of advice, and then find the pieces of each of those that works for you.

In many, many, many cases, the amount of communication we have with Collin my son about the business wouldn’t make sense. Like kids wouldn’t respond to it or something. And many relationships, Charles being a stay at home dad, and occasionally helping me out in the business would not be something that would work for them. We have to figure out what works for us so that we’re executing in a way that is in alignment with us because it’s the fastest way to find your version of success

Liam: And I think that holds true with a lot of the other items you shared about being mindful and being in the moment and kind of owning who you are. So thank you. I appreciate that.

Stacey: I appreciate hearing that. It’s sometimes easier to talk about than execute. I won’t lie. Because we all sort of want to be handed this sort of magical book of like, these are all the right things to do. That would be great.

Liam: Show me the place so I can get a touchdown. Yeah.

Stacey: Absolutely. And it’s funny because I live and die by strategy. It’s what we do. It’s what I do. It’s how I built my business. It’s how we’ve grown. It’s how I’ve been able to do all the things I’ve been able to do. So it’s easy to say, “Just give me the blueprint, and I’ll follow it.” There really is no master blueprint that’s going to work for everybody. There’s really not a whole lot of wrong ways to do it. I mean, there’s some like real sketchy ways to do it. But most positive action will get you will positive place. It just might take longer than others.

Liam: Probably true for life.

Stacey: I guess it’s probably very true for life

Tara: It is. I’m going to be curious to see what your son ends up doing, if he becomes an entrepreneur since you’ve involved him in this from such an early age. It’s really fascinating that he’s participated like that. Or whether he’ll run in the complete opposite direction.

Stacey: He’s very much so the opposite of me. He’s very quiet. The boy likes the plan. He wants to know what’s happening now. He wants to know what’s happening next. He wants to know what’s happening after that. I’m just like, “At the end of the day, we’re going to end up with dinner. Like, let’s just see what happens between now and then.” He’s like, “No, I want to know what’s happening minute by minute.” So I don’t know. I’ll be curious to see. Although I’m nothing like I was at 10. So who knows what happens in our adulthood?

Tara: That’s right. That’s right. Well, unfortunately, we’re out of time, Stacey. It’s been great chatting with you. I really loved meeting you, and your energy is contagious. I’m feeling like I’m ready to take the day. So I appreciate your sharing that too. I know it’s earlier there than it is here. So thanks for kicking off your day with us. Where can people find you online? You’ve mentioned your membership site and your podcast. Where else can people find you?

Stacey: Sort of the best place to start is thestaceyharris.com. That’ll link you to everything else. That will link you over to the agency Uncommonly More. It’ll link you to the training site Mic Backstage. We do live events. We do live workshop days. That’ll link you everywhere.

Tara: Great, thank you.

Stacey: Awesome. Thanks for having me.

Liam: Thanks, Stacey. It was a pleasure to meet you and spend some time with you.

Stacey: Thank you.

Tara: Thanks a lot. Bye-bye.

Liam: Bye-bye.

Liam: Thanks for listening to the show. We sure hope you enjoyed it as much as we did.

Tara: If you like what we’re doing here – meeting new people in our WordPress community – we invite you to tell others about it. We’re on iTunes and at hallwaychats-staging.ulpgsyz6-liquidwebsites.com.

Liam: Better yet, ask your WordPress friends and colleagues to join us on the show. Encourage them to complete the “Be on the show” form on our site, to tell us about themselves.