Feminine Chaos

Public: Oscar Bait

March 14, 2022 13:13 - 47 minutes

Production note: This episode was recorded in late February and got delayed in the transition to Substack, but it’s still here in time for the Oscars on March 27. Enjoy! Kat is joined by Oscars journalist Sasha Stone to talk about the convoluted drama of the Academy Awards, the conflict over Hollywood diversity quotas, and how best to serve underrepresented filmmakers. Sasha's website: Awards Daily Sasha's substack: Sasha Stone | Substack Kat's Reason essay on the Oscars and speech codes:...

The Vibes, They Are a Shiftin'

March 06, 2022 12:03 - 45 minutes

Kat is joined by Leigh Stein for a discussion of the vibe shift (whatever that is.) A longer version of this conversation is available for premium subscribers on Substack. Links: A Vibe Shift Is Coming. Will Any of Us Survive It? Kat on intimacy: The death of intimacy - UnHerd Maybe Baby essay: Coronavirus Sex Guidelines Must Consider Virtual Safety | Teen Vogue Questions about subscribing? Technical issues with your feed? Email [email protected] for support. All other inqui...

Joe Rogan, Bat Boy, and Journalism for the Working Class

February 11, 2022 12:12 - 43 minutes

Kat is joined by Batya Ungar-Sargon to talk about the Joe Rogan controversy, the Great Moon Hoax, and moving the media needle away from contempt for the working class. Links: Batya's book: Bad News: How Woke Media Is Undermining Democracy Kindle Edition Kat's New Statesman article: The Joe Rogan controversy isn't about truth – it's about control - New Statesman Spotify Quietly Pulls Over 70 Episodes of Joe Rogan's Podcast: Report More on the Moon Hoax: "The Great Moon Hoax" Is publishe...

On Humanizing the Bad Men

December 07, 2021 00:52 - 41 minutes

Kat is joined by journalist Christie Smythe to discuss justice reform, trial by media, the Kyle Rittenhouse affair, and a one-year retrospective on the Elle article in which she talked about her relationship with Martin Shkreli. An extended cut of this interview is available on our Patreon. Links: The Journalist and the Pharma Bro Christie at Business of Business: Latest Articles Tucker Carlson’s exclusive Rittenhouse interview draws nearly 5 million viewers to top CNN, MSNBC combine S...

Art Is Supposed to Be Mean

November 19, 2021 14:17 - 46 minutes

Kat is joined by poet and cultural critic Alice Gribbin for a discussion about art, empathy, Succession, and Shakespeare. An extended cut of this interview is available on Patreon. Links: Alice's empathy essay: https://alicegribbin.substack.com/p/the-empathy-racket The bad essay about political literature: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/22/opinion/fiction-poetry-trump.html See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information. This is a public episode. Get access to private episod...

Reparations, Repentance, and Making More Pie (with Nancy Rommelman)

October 31, 2021 00:00 - 42 minutes

Kat is joined by reporter and author Nancy Rommelman to talk about who's getting paid for the Dave Chappelle controversy, who's getting hurt by Instagram, and who should repent, motherf***er, repent! Links: Chappelle coverage: Netflix made a mess of the Dave Chappelle controversy. It's a crisis of Netflix's own making TV director compares transgender people's treatment to the HOLOCAUST ‎Blocked and Reported: Episode 87: HE'S GOT A WEAPON! on Apple Podcasts Dave Chappelle Addresses Netf...

Conflict Is Stored in the Kidneys

October 09, 2021 12:34 - 56 minutes

Kat is joined by Leigh Stein (novelist, poet) and Penny Lane (documentary filmmaker, kidney sharer) for a discussion about literary drama, organ donation, urban legends, and Bad Art Friends. Links: Who Is the Bad Art Friend? On the Internet, We're Always Famous Where do I start? Penny Lane's website: https://pennylaneismyrealname.com/bio/ Leigh Stein's website: https://www.leighstein.com/ See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information. This is a public episode. Get access...

In the Tumblrweeds

September 09, 2021 14:00 - 40 minutes

Kat is joined by Katherine Dee, a.k.a. Default Friend, for a conversation about Tumblr's discursive power and lesser-known internet subcultures . Katherine's work: Default Wisdom Tumblr U. Satire in the city Katherine Dee (@default_friend) Advertising campaign for American Horror Story illustrating the tumblr-to-TV pipeline: 15 Times "AHS: Cult" Did It's Best To Make You Trypophobic Tumblr's proto-#MeTooing of John Green: John Green Responded On Tumblr To Accusations Of Sexual Abuse ...

Poetic Justice

August 14, 2021 18:58 - 43 minutes

Kat talks with poet and novelist Leigh Stein about the world of contemporary poetry scandals. An extended version of this episode is available for subscribers on Patreon. Links: Jia Tolentino poem archived https://archive.is/Dzrjt Poetry magazine published a child porn convict in its prison issue, but did it deserve the backlash? Poetry Twitter Debates Whether 'After' Poems are Plagiarism A very unsympathetic (to Jia) account of the allegations against her family: NYT Bestselling Author...

Shrill and Shriller

June 07, 2021 15:01 - 1 hour

Kat and Phoebe discuss the (dis)pleasures of being scolded by sitcoms, evolving norms surrounding office-appropriate hairstyles, and a bizarre controversy surrounding Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt star Ellie Kemper. A clip from Shrill: BBC Three on Twitter: "Yikes." NYT: Why 'Kim's Convenience' Is 'Quietly Revolutionary' Slate: Ellie Kemper, queen of the Veiled Prophet Ball: “KKK princess” controversy, explained. Kat’s article about Ellie Kemper: Ellie Kemper and Twitter's Two Minutes Hate ...

The Sins of the Biographer Shall Be Visited Upon the Biographee

May 06, 2021 13:10 - 57 minutes

Kat and Phoebe discuss the scandalous allegations against Philip Roth biographer Blake Bailey and the eternally-creeping concept of "grooming." Links: Slate: Blake Bailey's former eighth grade student on being sexually assaulted by him years later. Also Slate: Blake Bailey's former Lusher students on how their eighth grade teacher groomed them. NOLA: Author Blake Bailey accused of abusing ex-Lusher students' trust for sex; denies illegal conduct Sexual Assault Allegations Against Biogra...

The Bald and the Beautiful

April 05, 2021 12:25 - 59 minutes

Kat and Phoebe talk about Prince William, pretender to the throne… of sexy baldness, that is. Is Prince William the world's sexiest bald man? Heck, is he sexy at all? And speaking of sexy, Naomi Wolf is kind of a weirdo these days, but does this mean that her 1990s feminist polemic, The Beauty Myth, is no longer good? Finally, we foray briefly into the weird, wonderful, and sometimes deadly world of gender reveal parties. Links: Stop trying to make 'sexy Prince William' happen - The Specta...

Royals

March 11, 2021 15:28 - 1 hour

Kat and Phoebe discuss Oprah's big wild interview with Meghan and Harry, formerly of the British monarchy, now just a couple of normal dudes... sort of. Also: can the endangered species known as the Basic Straight Girl survive when there is literally one good man available to be mated with? Links: 11 things we learned from Meghan and Harry's interview I'm OK -- You're a Racist Kat at Unherd: Hollywood's Cinderella has spoken Phoebe at Hedgehog Review: Straightness Studies | Who Do We Th...

Break a Leg, Gina Carano

February 20, 2021 15:01 - 1 hour

Kat and Phoebe discuss the mother of all privilege disclaimers and the cancellation of Mandalorian actress Gina Carano. Links: Ashley Judd's hospital interview The BBC interview Neglecting Yourself Doesn’t Make You a Better Mother Behind Disney's Firing of 'Mandalorian' Star Gina Carano Gina Carano and Crowd-Sourced McCarthyism See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information. This is a public episode. Get access to private episodes at femchaospod.substack.com/subscribe

What Might Have Bean

January 10, 2021 17:53 - 57 minutes

Kat and Phoebe get together on the day of the Capitol coup attempt to talk about the most important political and cultural event of our lifetimes: the Bean Dad Thread. And speaking of cans of beans, how about that cheerleader who said the N-word? Links: The original Bean Dad thread, screencapped: https://twitter.com/ManiacalV/status/1345870405085573122 Bean Dad apologizes: http://www.johnroderick.com/an-apology The NYT cheerleader story: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/26/us/mimi-groves-...

The Young Adult Episode

January 04, 2021 12:50 - 1 hour

Kat and Phoebe discuss the controversy over a "vitriolic, violent" Twitter thread that resulted in a YA author's cancellation (no, not the worms guy), before answering burning questions from listeners about who's causing all this drama, the impact of young adult fiction shenanigans on the culture at large, and the craziest MeTooing Kat ever witnessed in her years on the YA beat. Links: The inaugural article on all things YA Twitter: The Toxic Drama on YA Twitter Kat in Refinery29: How Th...

The Shkreliphant in the Room

December 26, 2020 20:35 - 47 minutes

Kat and Phoebe discuss the jailbird-journalist love affair between reviled "Pharma Bro" Martin Shkreli, and former crime reporter Christie Smythe. (Production note/apology: Kat's mic went wonky at about 30 minutes in, this slightly tinny result is the best we could do on short notice.) Links: The original Elle story Christie Smythe's Twitter account Followup interview with Smythe at Elle The Cut story on Shkreli's harassment of female journalists See acast.com/privacy for privacy and...

All the Sad Young Disgusting Worms

December 14, 2020 13:54 - 1 hour

Kat and Phoebe are joined by Jessa Crispin, literary critic and culture writer, to talk about dewy ingenues, the young-adultification of literature, and why that one guy on Book Twitter was screaming about worms. Links: Jessa on age gaps in the Boston Review: Pathologizing Desire Jessa's essay on the Underground Railroad vs Normal People, both for children David Bowles' epic "disgusting worms" Twitter meltdown Kat's 2017 (but still relevant) primer for understanding YA's internecine con...

Wholesome Wokefish and the Joy of Murder

December 09, 2020 16:39 - 51 minutes

Phoebe and Kat discuss Barack Obama, 44th President of the United States, now cancelled for intellectual pick-up artistry. Is putting your best foot forward a violation of consent? Will the stigma against duplicity-in-dating usher in a new era of unwashed, farting suitors who start every relationship by confessing their worst sins? Then, the ladies talk about the liberal feminists who are forcing women everywhere to endure lousy sex, and the murder mysteries that soothe the soul in the midst...

To Whom Does Broth Belong

November 30, 2020 18:54 - 56 minutes

Kat and Phoebe discuss the cultural appropriation controversy surrounding a Toronto-based broth bar, and whether having your lunch made fun of in fourth grade is a source of permanent trauma. Then: is this equal pay controversy between two LA Times food critics as simple as it seems? (Spoiler: Nope, it never is.) Links: Phoebe on the cultural appropriation of broth: No Soup For You. Can you even culturally appropriate… | by Phoebe Maltz Bovy | Nov, 2020 LA Times Responds to Accusation of ...

Tits and Pronouns

November 16, 2020 21:48 - 38.7 MB

Great (and not-so-great) tits are having a big week in the news cycle. In this episode, Kat and Phoebe discuss the nude homage to Mary Wollstonecraft that devolved into a gross body-shaming backlash of the nicely-shaped "everywoman." Then: you can have pronouns in the bio, or you can call yourself a "wife," but to do both looks like carelessness... or calculated political strategy. Links: The Guardian: 'Insulting to her': Mary Wollstonecraft sculpture sparks backlash Kat on the Wollstone...

The Pumpkin Spice POTUS

November 06, 2020 18:55 - 46.1 MB

It's all over but the shouting in the 2020 Presidential Election! While we wait for Trump to offer what is sure to be a mature and generous concession speech (lol), Kat and Phoebe come to you from a state of reasonably optimistic limbo to discuss solid gold bathroom fixtures, déjà vu exit poll backlash, and the non-legacy of Melania Trump. Links: Charles Blow at the NYT: Exit Polls Point to the Power of White Patriarchy A Cupcakes & Cashmere reader explains her vote for Donald Trump Kat'...

Special Punditry Edition

November 02, 2020 15:08 - 41.6 MB

In a special pre-election bonus episode, Kat and Phoebe discuss their respective worries about the vote, the culture wars, and what part of a cat Donald Trump's mouth resembles. Also, our favorite supermodel makes a naked writhing pregnancy announcement. Links: What Makes a Man Manly? Trump and Biden Offer Competing Answers Phoebe's essay on the election and the culture wars Kat's essay: Culture war forever The Bernie Sanders DGAF interview: Opinion | Bernie Sanders Wants to Change Y...

All About Amy

October 28, 2020 15:19 - 55.2 MB

Two Amys, both alike in dignity… except that one is a cancelled writer and the other is a Supreme Court justice. Kat and Phoebe discuss how the sad state of contemporary journalism puts "privileged" writers in a bind (to pitch or not to pitch, that is the question), then turn to some of the more bizarre so-called feminist critiques of Amy Coney Barrett. Links: Kat on the cancellation of Amy Roost: White Women Need Not Apply Cathy Young's good explainer on all things Amy Coney Barrett: The...

The Dickscourse

October 24, 2020 20:07 - 37.6 MB

An accidental masturbation incident (Phoebe: Was it, though?) on a New Yorker Zoom call prompts a very serious, very special discussion about all things weenie and wang. Links: New Yorker Suspends Jeffrey Toobin for Masturbating on Zoom Call Phoebe Maltz Bovy: Getting hands-on with the #MeToobin Dickscourse "Don't act like you're not impressed!" See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

Patrons Exclusive: Enby Envy, with a Hollywood Ending

October 17, 2020 12:32 - 76.1 MB

Frilly dresses, dollhouses, and a relentless horde of thirsty men attempting to woo you at all times: such is the life of a woman. Any woman, every woman, all day, every day. ...Or is it? Phoebe and Kat explore a non-binary writer's unusual notion of la vie d'une femme, which is just as relatable (i.e. not very) as Emily Ratajowski's essay about supermodel selfhood. Then, a special bonus for Patrons: a real-time attempt to make sense of the controversy surrounding Gal Gadot's casting as Cleo...

All Apologies

October 02, 2020 16:08 - 72 MB

Kat and Phoebe discuss Matthew Mayhew, the professor who apologized (and apologized, and apologized!) for co-authoring an article in defense of college football — which has some surprising parallels to outraged commenter culture on the Cupcakes and Cashmere blog. Is frivolity simply off limits until the new year? Also: an author responds to a critical book review by blocking the publication on Twitter, sparking the week's most enjoyable miniature controversy over anonymous reviews and the de...

Grooming, Consent, and Princeton Said What?

September 23, 2020 20:55 - 51.4 MB

Grooming! It's not just that thing you stopped doing during quarantine; it's also a thing done to women of a certain, nay, any age. In this episode, Kat and Phoebe discuss safe sex (as in, it is never safe to have sex, ever) and the grooming of consenting adults, followed by a dip into the latest spat between the Ivy Leagues and Donald Trump's Department of Education. Links: Kat's Persuasion essay on the reboot of old-school purity concerns as consent culture Princeton's racism confess...

Sex, Status, and Strawberries

September 18, 2020 14:27 - 35.1 MB

In what may be the silliest episode of Feminine Chaos yet recorded, Phoebe and Kat unpack the mysteries of a particularly excellent Refinery29 money diary, including a debate on exactly how many boobs a modern woman should have (it's more than you think.) Then: FASHION. In our pandemic times, is getting dressed even a thing anymore? Are bespoke face coverings the new black? And who, exactly, is allowed to wear the famous Tik-Tok-trendy strawberry dress? Links: Refinery29 money diary: The ...

Impostor Syndrome, Latecomings, and... You Like Me? You Really Like Me?!

September 16, 2020 02:21 - 58.6 MB

It's been a banner month for fakers, imposters, poseurs, and actors of all varieties. Kat and Phoebe discuss the peculiar phenomenon of academic hoaxsters assuming transracial identities, which may have a surprising parallel in the aspirational machismo of Phoebe's high school classmates. Then: is it "queer" to think women are interesting? And what's the deal with the Oscars' new diversity guidelines? Links: Jessica Krug's confession on Medium CV Vitolo: Another academic racial fraud? ...

Chaotic Youth, Part Deux: The Aaron Coleman Affair

August 31, 2020 21:29 - 36.7 MB

Special for subscribers: our Bloggingheads discussion of The Youth continues here, with a dissection of the Aaron Coleman saga. Do the 19 year-old Coleman's terrible acts as a middle schooler disqualify him from holding public office? Does his obvious political incompetence render the middle school misbehavior irrelevant? Can a Canadian raccoon be elected to the U.S. presidency? Links: Kat's RocaNews article on the progressive implications of Aaron Coleman's candidacy Coleman's intervie...

This Is Why We Can't Have Nice #MeToo

August 16, 2020 20:22 - 58 MB

Your hosts discuss the controversy surrounding Holyhoke mayor Alex Morse, the sex scandal that... wasn't. What does the attempt to gin up outrage about Morse's Tinder matching (sometimes with students as young as Legally Adult!) tell us about the current state of #MeToo? What's the difference between unwanted overtures and a bad chicken sandwich? Do Zoomers even know what love is?! Then, a viral tweetstorm ignites a debate on the merits of dissing other people's relationships (and butts), an...

Tone Police, Capital Ws, and Ivy League Disemvoweling

August 07, 2020 20:47 - 51.4 MB

Phoebe's lurking in Facebook mom groups inspires a deep dive on tone policing: what it is, why it's used, and whether it killed Alexander Hamilton. (It definitely did.) Then, a discussion of language conventions: the Washington Post's controversial decision to capitalize the "w" in white, and one college graduate's disavowal of her family wealth complete with brutal disemvoweling of her Ivy League credentials. Also, Kat finally went to IKEA, and it was really depressing. Links: A definitio...

Bari's Burn Book, Exhausting Friendships, and Beautiful Poodle Privilege

July 24, 2020 17:03 - 48.4 MB

In this new patrons-only episode, Kat returns from the Maine woods to discover some shocking news: Bari Weiss and Andrew Sullivan have quit their jobs, gotten married, and embarked upon a cross-country murder spree… right? (Phoebe: "No.") After discussing this latest installment in the ongoing media revolution and debating the existence of the guillotine emoji, we turn our attention to a bleak portrait of interracial friendships offered by Ann Friedman and Aminatou Sow's new book — and Kat c...

The Most Shocking Letter

July 09, 2020 20:08 - 39.1 MB

You know how it is: one moment you're hanging out in a hot tub full of intellectual luminaries, and the next thing you know, someone passes you... an open letter. What're you gonna do, not sign it? In front of all these people? In this hastily-produced episode (ed note: sorry about the dog barking), Kat and Phoebe discuss the now-notorious Harper's open letter in defense of free expression, the hidden illuminati messages therein, the massive blowback against its normie signatories, and how o...

Master Cleanse, Midsomer Mediators, and Cancelled Cops

July 08, 2020 12:10 - 35 MB

In a new subscribers-only episode, Kat and Phoebe discuss the appeal of self-helpy handbooks for social justice before diving into a vigorous debate over TV cops (and, to a certain extent, TV's COPS). Are cops too often portrayed as unambiguous heroes? Does a clip from a 1969 episode of Dragnet reveal an additional layer of complexity? Why do murderers keep moving to Midsomer?! Relevant links: Kat's Tablet article on social justice as self help Time magazine on cops and cancellation: ...

Himbo! WaPo! ...BIPOC?

June 24, 2020 16:32 - 55 MB

We're pivoting to audio here on the Feminine Chaos Patreon, but rest assured, we still look fantastic (and the poodles are still COMPLETELY NUDE.) In this episode: Phoebe educates Kat on the conceptual and spiritual definition of "himbo," a recent source of Twitter controversy We discuss BIPOC, which might be a useful acronym, or not, as its precise meaning remains a mystery Was the WaPo article about a private citizen's blackface Halloween costume necessary? Are blackface meta-jokes a...

Still More Riot Discourse

June 12, 2020 03:11 - 16.1 MB

Due to technical difficulties, we're audio-only for this round -- but no less chaotic! In the immediate aftermath of a Bloggingheads discussion, Kat and Phoebe regroup for a more intimate Patrons-only chat. Could anti-racist reading lists be the secret to COVID immunity? Is coronavirus even a thing anymore? Who has more credibility: our nation's public health experts, or our respective poodles? See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

AUDIO ONLY: Off-Brand Wokeness, Masculine Ideals, and a Covid Kodak Moment

May 30, 2020 12:47 - 32.1 MB

For the audiophiles! After a week of unrelenting terrible bad news, nothing soothes the soul like a fluffy lifestyle blog built around aspirational, tasteful, aesthetically curated consumption… if only there were any left. But in these unprecedented times, staying socially aware while socially distant is a full-time job. In this episode, Kat and Phoebe take a look at: Cupcakes and Cashmere's long-awaited (or was it?) pivot toward woke self-improvement, which was either too much or too-litt...

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